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Accident - Missing Caliper Bolts
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RyanR
 


Member Since: 29 Apr 2018
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 46

Canada 2007 Discovery 3 4.0 V6 Petrol SE Auto Java BlackDiscovery 3
Accident - Missing Caliper Bolts

My 07 LR3 SE was in an accident this past Thursday. I was not the driver and am out of country so trying to deal with the insurance process from a distance.

The driver pulled into a gas station and indicates that when they tried to brake the vehicle did not slow down and proceeded to strike a parked car with enough force to push it over an embankment. The LR3 sustained damage to the front left bumper area, all cosmetic nothing structural.

The collision center that has the vehicle now inspected the brakes and found that the bolts that hold the front left caliper in place are missing. They say the caliper came out of place and interfered with the braking system. Below are the photos they provided of the caliper.







I had the front rotor(discs) and pads replaced by a garage the beginning of January. I'd say about 1000km had been put on the vehicle since then, the majority of which was in the first 11 days. After that it was driven short distances on the odd occasion. I've followed up with the garage that did the work however they indicate they would only have removed the bracket bolts for the rotor/pad change and not the caliper bolts themselves. I have trouble beleiving this was the case as had the bolts already been missing at that point I feel that it would have been noticed right away by the mechanic and the caliper would have fallen off in their hand as soon as they removed the bracket bolts and lifted it off the rotor. It would not be possible to remove the assembly, install new pads and rotor if the caliper was not attached to the bracket to begin with. They must have removed the caliper from the bracket and not installed the bolts on completion of the job or only finger tightened the bolts and forgot to go back and torque them. The vehicle did not receive any other service between then and now and was in the care of a 75 year old lady who for certain did not get underneath it and work on the brakes.

Can anyone suggest another possibility on how the caliper bolts could be missing? I really like the garage and the owner is a previous LR mechanic.

Ryan R
 

Last edited by RyanR on 12th Mar 2019 4:14 pm. Edited 1 time in total 
Post #203625912th Mar 2019 2:47 pm
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Paddington
 


Member Since: 30 May 2013
Location: Southampton
Posts: 280

England 2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 SE Manual Vienna GreenDiscovery 3

Hi Ryan
Sorry to hear about your discovery being involved in a accident.
The brake Caliper has to be removed to fit new brake pads onto the brake pad Carrier.
So I would say that the bolts were not fitted or not torqued correctly.
But if I'm wrong some will be along shortly to correct me.
 
Previous cars
Discovery 200 tdi
Discovery 300 tdi
Discovery td5 
 
Post #203627712th Mar 2019 3:40 pm
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grzesiul
 


Member Since: 11 May 2008
Location: UK
Posts: 6265

Poland 2016 Discovery 4 3.0 SDV6 SE Auto Loire BlueDiscovery 4

I guess some garage did disk replacement onyour LR4 some time ago?? I would ask them where the Censored are the bolts on carriers???
G
  
Post #203627812th Mar 2019 3:47 pm
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RyanR
 


Member Since: 29 Apr 2018
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 46

Canada 2007 Discovery 3 4.0 V6 Petrol SE Auto Java BlackDiscovery 3

It is challenging not being there to see things for myself.

From looking at videos, I believe the mechanic is correct the caliper assembly can be removed by just taking off the bracket bolts, these are the larger 12 point bolts. The caliper unit would remain attached to the bracket and work could be completed. Although this may be his normal practice it would seem it wasn't done that way in this case as it would not be possible if the caliper wasn't attached to the bracket to start with. The only explanation I can see is that they removed the caliper bolts to lift the unit out of the way prior to removing the bracket and then forgot to put them back in on install.

Note what I am referring to as the bracket I believe is also called the brake pad carrier.
  
Post #203627912th Mar 2019 3:52 pm
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rrhool
 


Member Since: 28 Aug 2014
Location: Norfolk
Posts: 4398

United Kingdom 2007 Discovery 3 TDV6 SE Manual Zermatt SilverDiscovery 3

The brake pads cannot be changed without taking the caliper off of the carrier (by removing the slider pin bolts). The Brake pads will not fit through the inside of the carrier.
I think the slider pin bolts are missing, going by your photos. They have either been left out completely, or only inserted finger tight.
 Richard


D3 SE 2007. Triumph 2.5Pi 1973. Ferguson TEA20 1948.



Discovery 2 4.0 ES 2001- Gone
Discovery 1 300Tdi ES '95 - Gone
Range Rover Classic '79 - Gone 
 
Post #203628412th Mar 2019 4:05 pm
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lynalldiscovery
 


Member Since: 22 Dec 2009
Location: Maidstone
Posts: 7274

United Kingdom 2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 Metropolis LE Auto Bonatti GreyDiscovery 3

I would bet you can indeed slide the pads up from the inside of the carrier with the calliper attached, but you have to ask why struggle with a very heavy lump of metal? when 30 seconds makes life so much easier and how did they grease the calliper slides? and how did they clean the stainelss pad carrier/shims?

Also would say the carrier mounting bolts are tough to get at with calliper fitted.

Maybe ask them to show you how they do it on your car then make your own mind up?
  
Post #203629012th Mar 2019 4:36 pm
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RyanR
 


Member Since: 29 Apr 2018
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 46

Canada 2007 Discovery 3 4.0 V6 Petrol SE Auto Java BlackDiscovery 3

Their indication was as they were replacing the discs at the same time, they just removed the carrier bolts to take it off as a complete unit.

So far there doesn't seem to be a plausible explanation for how the bolts could be missing other than never reinstalled or not torqued. I don't think they will have a leg to stand on. Still waiting on the insurance claim agent to get back to me on this now. I believe the garage's liability insurance should be covering my repairs and the payout for the car it wrote off when it hit.
  
Post #203629412th Mar 2019 4:47 pm
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lynalldiscovery
 


Member Since: 22 Dec 2009
Location: Maidstone
Posts: 7274

United Kingdom 2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 Metropolis LE Auto Bonatti GreyDiscovery 3

No judge in the land would believe their end of the story and would ask the one simple question, if you did not remove them, why didnt you notice they were either slack or loose enough to fall out?
Or maybe they were totally missing from day 1?
  
Post #203631712th Mar 2019 5:50 pm
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Sydney
 


Member Since: 11 Aug 2013
Location: St Neots
Posts: 903

United Kingdom 2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 Base 7 Seat Manual Zermatt SilverDiscovery 3

I smell the proverbial bovine excrement being spouted by the workshop. They should have installed new bolts to the correct torque setting. New bolts come with thread lock already applied so the bolts would not have fallen out.

Where there's blame there's a claim, screw them to the wall as the accident could have been potentially fatal.
 De-Tango
V8 Brakes
EGRs blanked
Running boards
3 flash indicators and clock on dash
Blingy grille... 
 
Post #203631912th Mar 2019 6:02 pm
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M3DPO
 


Member Since: 22 Sep 2010
Location: Notts.
Posts: 8041

England 2014 Discovery 4 3.0 SDV6 HSE Lux Auto Corris GreyDiscovery 4

Judging by the amount of rust in the bolt hole the latter is correct, it’s a wonder the brakes worked at all with them missing.
Hope the OP hasn’t upset someone Whistle
 It can when others can't,
It will when others won't,
It goes where others don't. 
 
Post #203632012th Mar 2019 6:03 pm
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RyanR
 


Member Since: 29 Apr 2018
Location: Nova Scotia
Posts: 46

Canada 2007 Discovery 3 4.0 V6 Petrol SE Auto Java BlackDiscovery 3

Well I guess this is now in the hands of the insurance company. They are reviewing whether they will go after the garage or not. If they do and recover the repair cost I should be clear of an at-fault accident. If they don't, they cover the repair and blame me.

Insurance companies are a bunch of crooks.
  
Post #203684314th Mar 2019 8:22 am
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