Member Since: 27 Jun 2005
Location: All at sea
Posts: 496
Would a D3 make a good replacement for a Defender?
OK guys I'll admit it, I want to reduce my LR fleet to one vehicle that can do everything that my 1996 TDi300 Defender 90 and my RRS can do......... be great offroad and comfy on it. The RRS is too nice a car to be taking to the places where I take my Def. I reckon that a D3 would do most things I want out of a 4x4, there are a couple of drawbacks with it though over the RRS and 90 - it is BIG, the wheelbase is so much longer than the 90 and the interior is errr how do I put this ..... too much of a van size for a single bloke like me (I don't require 7 seats when 99% I'm the only person in the car!) So how do those of you that take your D3's offroading rate it against the like of the Defender?
I know there are several of you on here who have both (and one who has a Def, D3 and an RRS!) so spill the beans please!
Also....how easy is it to get the usual offroading toys like winches (not factory fitted ones please, proper ones!) rock sliders/ sill guards and underbody protection panels for a D3?Now a disillusioned new Land Rover buyer and have jumped ship to something less expensive and more reliable that hugs trees.... now driving a Mini Countryman PHEV as well as my trusty and brilliant 1996 Epsom Green Defender90 Tdi300
Go for it. Nothing wrong with being a single bloke in a 7-seater.
(11000 miles with one occupant, 30 miles with all seats filled)
20th Oct 2006 5:37 pm
DSL Keeper of the wheelie bin
Member Since: 11 May 2006
Location: Off again! :-)
Posts: 72799
I offroad my D3 (well just started) & far prefer it to the Defender 90 I had. OK so it might not be that hardcore but after offroading U can sit at 85 on the Mway with the iPod pumping & the climate control on. Besides, my Defender had traction control which clamped the brakes on all 4 wheels when it got slippy, something the D3 does not do! I've been up some tracks that I was sure the Defender would have struggled to cope with. The LRE guy I did the half day course with said that most people could get a D3 most of the places a Defender could go and it would need an expert to go further with the Defender (or Alex's D1!!!). Go for it with the D3.
PS most of my mileage is one person in a seven seater. I've only once had one person in the rear of the car ever .
20th Oct 2006 7:19 pm
CFB
Member Since: 02 Dec 2005
Location: Bradford, West Yorkshire
Posts: 6100
I agree, the D3 is very capable off-road, the only thing that limits it IMO is the size (very wide) and the fact that most owners don't want to trash their paint on scratchy green lane runs. In open rugged terrain the D3 will go anywhere a Defender will and with MT's or AT's fitted probably even further.2020 BMW X1 18d XDrive X-Line Auto
20th Oct 2006 8:26 pm
dlane
Member Since: 02 Oct 2006
Location: Colorado
Posts: 5
LR3 vs Defender
There is no doubt that the Defender is the winner in an off-road contest. But, the D3/LR3 will go almost anywhere a Defender will, with exeptions. The major downfall of the LR3 is the clearances. The Defendor as exelect clearances all around. The approach of the LR3 is good, but not as good as the D90. The breakover is no contest, and the departure is the worst of all on the LR3.
If you are not climbing over large boulders in a rock field, and you don't have extreme changes of angles, the LR3 is extreme good.
There is one company out there that as a hidden winch mount for the D3. It is very cool to see that it is completely hidden behind the bumper. Or you can get the ARB bumper and be done with it.
Changing the tires is highly recommended. I went with 18" rims because I have a US LR3, and that is the smallest rim I can fit. Then adding on the 285-60/R18 tires will get you about another inch of lift.
There are two companies out there with rock sliders, and another company with what could be called sill protectors. These will not protect the doors though. The rock sliders are not ready from either company yet. But they should be very soon.
The technology that is in the D3/LR3 gives it an advantage over the Defender for the moderness of the car. But, you will not be doing any major engine/mechanical work to the truck as there is just too many electronics on the vehical. Check out my gallery to see some of the adventures that I have taken mine in Colorado and Utah.
Cheers!
Dave.
20th Oct 2006 8:48 pm
Tim in Scotland
Member Since: 27 Jun 2005
Location: All at sea
Posts: 496
Dave those are cracking pictures - I do mainly runs through forests with a bit of rock climbing and a lot of soft wet marshy ground out on moors. It is interesting to see that you haven't fitted any underguards (yet?). Quite a few of the guys I offroad with have 110's so I suppose that a D3 can go anywhere they can get! You also appear to be running on what appear to be quite road biased tyres in your photos.... or is that a trick of the light! Thanks for you reply. I love my Def and the RRS but the cost of running 2 cars is really getting a bit steep here, especially when the Defender only does about 2000 miles a year. The Sport is OK but doesn't have the same ground clearance as the D3. There are silly plastic spoilers in front of the spare wheel of the RRS which scrape and get broken too easily, which doesn't seem to be a problem for the D3.Now a disillusioned new Land Rover buyer and have jumped ship to something less expensive and more reliable that hugs trees.... now driving a Mini Countryman PHEV as well as my trusty and brilliant 1996 Epsom Green Defender90 Tdi300
20th Oct 2006 11:00 pm
nwoods
Member Since: 04 Apr 2006
Location: Southern California
Posts: 563
The D3 can be beefed up, but it takes some money. I fitted a 3 piece skid plate system from British Pacific (ironically, a southern california based company). They are quite stout aluminum plates and work well. (http://www.britishpacific.com/)
The normal air suspension equiped D3 can ride between 10" and 12" of ground clearance, depending if extened off road mode is triggered (which is computer controlled).
I have a coil sprung LR3, and if you apply money, and replace the factory shock mounts and struts, you can get a permanent 12" of clearance. So far, I have only replaced the springs, which has brought me up 10.5" of clearance (smilar to normal Off Road mode for the air equiped D3).
Front and rear protection is available now, via ARB (front bumper) and Kaymar (rear bumper), but the rear clearance is still not ideal.
Rumor has it that OME will begin working on a lift kit for the coil sprung D3 soon (after production of the 07 Jeep Wrangler is underway).
If I were in your place, I would wait a bit for the OME lift kit (could be another 6 months though), and get a coil sprung D3. It has the simplicty you might like, the comfort of the D3, the potential abilities of a Defender.
It is very important that you get a D3 equiped with the rear locker. There is no retrofit available, so get it from the factory first.
There are several options with the 18" and 17" rims for good off road tires. The Goodyear MTR's in 18" rims are quite nice, and Cooper STT's are very cool also.
As for width, get the 3M clear coat over your paint and worry not about the brushes and scratches. It peels right off when you are done
I have a LOT of D3 (LR3) photos on my website doing silly things off road.
Member Since: 02 Jan 2005
Location: Germany... Not far from both the US and Hard German rock...
Posts: 1089
I do agree withy most of what has been said...
Here are just my two cents...
There is a company in France which does a product called "Protec Magnet". Those are huge magnetics strips (The thin kind that you put on your fridge door...) which clung to the bodywork and protect the paint from scratches... They are especially good for the side and will work on a D3 because of the steel bodywork... They don't work, of course, on aluminium... Thus the bonnet is left exposed. But it is better than nothing even though it could be expensive.
I don't have any interest in them ! 8) But I do think that if you are interested in protecting the paint of that "wide" vehicle on some greenlanes, it might be worth considering.
Click image to enlarge
Georgia On My Mind...
21st Oct 2006 5:30 am
Tim in Scotland
Member Since: 27 Jun 2005
Location: All at sea
Posts: 496
Thanks guys, I had never thought of going down the coil sprung route, the problem with a permanent lift over here is that the car would never get into a car-park as it would be too high (they put the ceilings and bariers low here to stop commercial vans parking in multistorey parks). I cannot get my un-lifted Defender into most carparks here and have to use parking meters and onstreet parking = not very secure and expensive, my Def is old enough not to have an anti-theft device fitted.
I was considering going for a 2nd hand/"pre-owned" D3 rather than a new one as I wouldn't be too worried about additional scratches but I imagine there will be very few around with the rear locking diff on them - certainly I haven't seen any on the LR websites of the dealers. The other problem with looking for 2nd hand is there are few (if any!) white D3's in the UK and they are the best colour for offroading as they just don't show the scratches and scrapes like other colours - my Epsom Green Def looks like it has been dragged backward through a hedge (which it has!) with all the scratches on it.
Nathan those are great pics, does your D3 have the locking rear diff?Now a disillusioned new Land Rover buyer and have jumped ship to something less expensive and more reliable that hugs trees.... now driving a Mini Countryman PHEV as well as my trusty and brilliant 1996 Epsom Green Defender90 Tdi300
21st Oct 2006 10:17 am
nwoods
Member Since: 04 Apr 2006
Location: Southern California
Posts: 563
Tim in Scotland wrote:
Nathan those are great pics, does your D3 have the locking rear diff?
No it does not, and it hasn't been an issue until recently, in Moab Utah there was a rock I could not climb without a locker. Two other D3's walked up it, but I struggled.
There are probably many D3's around with the locker. Look for a full size spare under the rear, if it has a full size spare, it probably has the "HD" option which is the locker. Most people and probably many dealers would not know if it's there or not.
21st Oct 2006 3:45 pm
Tim in Scotland
Member Since: 27 Jun 2005
Location: All at sea
Posts: 496
I have been away from the forums for a while, but I think the rear locker has only just become available as an option over here............. stand to be corrected though.Now a disillusioned new Land Rover buyer and have jumped ship to something less expensive and more reliable that hugs trees.... now driving a Mini Countryman PHEV as well as my trusty and brilliant 1996 Epsom Green Defender90 Tdi300
21st Oct 2006 4:29 pm
catweasel
Member Since: 05 May 2006
Location: Bundaleer
Posts: 4805
to identify the rear locking diff, look for the solenoid actuator on top of the rear diff when in offroad height. pic from chesters gallery.
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But it is better than nothing even though it could be expensive.
