DISCO3.CO.UK - View topic - Rovacom to support the D3

craig

Member Since: 08 Aug 2006
Location: Home of LR.
Posts: 2545

2006 Discovery 3 TDV6 Base 7 Seat Manual Cairns Blue

when

8th Aug 2007 9:28 pm

10forcash

Member Since: 09 Jun 2005
Location: Ubique
Posts: 16534

2007 Discovery 3 TDV6 HSE Manual Zermatt Silver

DiscoStu wrote:
colin wrote:
I had absolutely no idea that you were so demanding or had such high expectations.

Yeh - fancy expecting it to work

Think Colin must have worked at BMW at some point - "The fault won't occur if you don't attempt to use that feature"

gotta reinvest the dosh (less a few consilatory beers

) in something that works outside of someone's imagination

8th Aug 2007 9:30 pm

DG
Site Moderator

Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50934

Oh oh ...I've missed all the fun again

21 year LR veteran > D2 GS 2003 > D3 S 2006 > D3 HSE 2009 > D4 HSE 2013 > D4 HSE 2015 > D5 HSE 2018 > DS HSE R-Dynamic P300e 2021

8th Aug 2007 9:38 pm

craig

Member Since: 08 Aug 2006
Location: Home of LR.
Posts: 2545

Not yet DG

http://www.disco3.co.uk/forum/topic13587.html

8th Aug 2007 9:41 pm

WillMyth

Member Since: 11 Jul 2007
Location: Tuam
Posts: 400

2007 Discovery 3 TDV6 S Manual Lugano Teal

Well 10fc you got more working on yours then I have on my FMSVstill trying to find the engen and gear box

9th Aug 2007 3:22 am

10forcash

Member Since: 09 Jun 2005
Location: Ubique
Posts: 16534

have you tried lifting the bonnet and pointing the FM box at it? preferaby whilst saying 'dere ya go yer fikin useless pile o' shoite'
wanna join in the trip to Limassol?

9th Aug 2007 4:14 pm

BBS SPY
Site Sponsor

Member Since: 15 Jun 2007
Location: Sunny Cyprus
Posts: 3054

2005 Discovery 3 TDV6 Base 7 Seat Auto Bonatti Grey

Hiya 10forcash.

Having publically apologised on our own forum, I can only but apologise on this forum.
As i have stated, i had no intent to deceive or mis direct you or anyone else as to the newness and possible bugginess of our Disco 3 software or its current limited capabilities.
This forum has quotes to that effect, the exact details of what the system does and does not do are avialiable on line in our shop for all to read.

Quote:

I really want the kit to work, but I don't have the time to wait that Colin assumes 'enthusiasts' do

Maybe this is the core difference, my reference to your expectations was certainly that i had made an assumption that your expectations might allow for some degree of latitude in respect of any potential problems.

We work ridiculously hard here for very little money, and try our damndest to give people another much lower cost option in the industry. We dont always get it right first time, in fact i don't think we ever have and getting it to a fully working state requires serious effort. But anyone can tell you that we have a long history of sticking with it until it is much better than right This Custom based CAN network thing is some tricky technology fraught with anti access security just for starters.

In your case, TFC you quickly reported encountering two problems on our forum.

Although you did not mention any trouble accessing all of the other systems on the vehicle, you stated that you got a VSE011 error (module not installed) when trying to access
ABS/ETC
Body Control
Driver aid / PDC
Cruise control
Instrumentation
Steering / Suspension
Safety restraints
This was quite significant as it prevented you from even running the modules for these systems.

You also told us that you were getting a math overflow error when updating modules on the server although this was simply a report and did not stop modules being uploaded.

You were responded to immediately and told that that they would be looked into and we would get back to you.

These problems were in fact identified and rectified within only a very short time.
the first was due to an invisible space being on the end of some lines in a lookup file that converts names of programs to descriptions. This was causing the files to not be transferred to the server along with all the others.
This was missed in that after we transferred the SM129 we saw the large pile of files appear in the server and just assumed they were all there rather than check off all 30 of them 1 by 1

The other was a spare space count overflow caused by the massive new memory size of the MV server causing an overflow only when the server was near empty which is something that we had simply not encountered during development mainly because we develop on lite servers.

However your subsequent abrasive comments of complaint and requests for costs / compensation

Quote:
Will I have access to the full system before Thursday this week?
If not, I presume Colin will reimburse me for the time & fuel costs for a second visit to my client on that day....

led me to understand that you were far from happy with the system and were unlikely to become so. So rather than continue communicating with you in respect of solving the problem, I therefore offered you a full refund including the cost of shipping both ways and my personal apology for the system not being what you had envisaged, (that being a fully fledged, fully featured, plug and play, bug free system) not being and the problems you encountered.

Iain, despite your extensive provocation

Quote:
apart from that fuc kwit in Cyprus!

I have at all times acted respectfully and professionally towards you and despite your declaration to me of no hard feelings, your comments since then on this forum indicate differently.
Can you please explain to me what i did wrong that you should wish to undermine the ongoing development of this system and what more you could possibly have expected from me?

Regards

Last edited by BBS SPY on 13th Aug 2007 11:57 am. Edited 1 time in total

13th Aug 2007 9:37 am

catweasel

Member Since: 05 May 2006
Location: Bundaleer
Posts: 4805

I was talking with a bloke the other day (he seems to know you over the phone and I respect his views ) about this system and would like to know that with the SV system you cannot buy individual modules but get the whole lot. in the conversation it was stated that to unlock all modules requires further licences (more money) is this correct and what do you actually get.

13th Aug 2007 10:31 am

BBS SPY
Site Sponsor

Member Since: 15 Jun 2007
Location: Sunny Cyprus
Posts: 3054

Hello Catweasel

In the past when introducing coverage for new vehicle models on all our systems we have broken them down into their individual systems and provided individuably purchasable licences for each and every one. this allows which systems the user wants to access to be picked and chosen at will making the system far less expensive. Someone might start off with just the engine management than buy the licence for the airbag or ABS etc. expanding as they go, This is still the case with the MV in respect of the way that it covers all the earlier models, However as you probably know already, the Disco 3 in common with all newer Land Rover vehicles we have introduced, is a collection of anything up to 29 seperate ECU's that are very tightly networked together by CAN and fibre optic buses. A failure or problem in one vehicle system causes a knock on affect in many others and other ECU's have to be present to act as Gateway devices to allow communications to others. So rather than provide individul systems as seperatly licencable modules, we simply give every single one of the 29 modules the for the Disco 3 the same SM129 licence. Once that module is licenced you can access any system fitted to a Disco 3, on an MV that means any variant or option on any disco 3, on an SV that means any disco 3 regardless of variant or options.

When an SV server arrives at a customers, it is standard practice for them to run a built in Scan module and send us a copy of the results.
This identifies all the systems on any given vehicle and tells us what SM vehicle system modules to licence.
Given what i have just told you about all disco 3 systems being under one SM number you appreciate that the Disco 3 scan is really irrelevant but its still nice to be able to confirm what ECU's are installed. However this was not the primary purporse of the scan software which is intended more for things like a P38 Range Rover which may have one of two different airbags that would be hard to distinguish otherwise etc.

So if you have a P38 range rover and it has 7 systems identified by the scan, your SV will mean the licence for all of those 7 systems, likewise any SV for a Disco 3 will get SM129 licenced. and although that is just one SM module licence there are 29 modules unlocked by it which cover any of the following.

Petrol Normally Aspirated V8 HS CAN BUS
Petrol Normally Aspirated V6 HS CAN BUS
Diesel V6 HS CAN BUS
Central Junction Box / BCU MS CAN BUS
ABS / ETC HS CAN BUS
Park Brake Module HS CAN BUS
Ride Level Module (EAS) HS CAN BUS
Restraints Control Module HS CAN BUS
Occupant Classification System HS CAN BUS
Transmission Control Module HS CAN BUS
Transfer Box Control Module HS CAN BUS
Rear Differential Control Module HS CAN BUS
Heating Ventilation and AC MS CAN BUS
Fuel Burning Heater MS CAN BUS
Instrument Pack Low Line HS CAN BUS
Instrument Pack High Line HS CAN BUS
Adaptive Front Lighting System HS CAN BUS
Audio Amplifier Module MOST BUS
Integrated Head Unit (Radio) Low Line MS CAN BUS / MOST BUS
Integrated Head Unit (Radio) High Line MS CAN BUS / MOST BUS
Satellite Radio Module MOST BUS
LCD Touch Screen Display (Front Electronics Module) MOST BUS
Rear Entertainment Module MOST BUS
Traffic Message Channel MOST BUS
Television Module MOST BUS
Telephone MOST BUS
Steering Angle Sensor HS CAN BUS
All Terrain Control Module HS CAN BUS
Cruise Control HS CAN BUS
Parking Distance Control Drivers Aid MS CAN BUS
Tyre Pressure Monitor MS CAN BUS

Albeit a small mistake (hidden end of line spaces) in the version 10forcash had, did not allow him to transfer of a few of those modules (listed previously) to the vehicle server the other systems would have been fine.

Obviously as an SV, it will only work on one vehicle and one vehicle cannot be both Petrol and Diesel and a vehicle may not have all options, you wont get to use all of these. but it is nice to know that should you later fit an extra such as sat nav or fuel burning heater, the software will automatically work on it as well

As the help availiable for SM129 on our shop says, http://www.blackbox-solutions.com/shop/help/SM129.html we have done the main feature of reading and clearing all the vehicle manufacturer specific fault codes and can identify the meaning of all 65 thousand possibilities, the freeze frame, fault Cause, Status flag and other record type data etc.
In some core systems we have also added settings features of the Car configuration file, Mcode (module fitment codes) and service interval reset stuff, However in the vast majority we have not gone beyond only the basic 11 settings information values. to see exacly what is in each systems settings page, we have a downloadable demo in which you can open the page for each system.

I should mention that as far as we are concerned, it is very early days for these collective SM129 modules and following some help we got when we posted a request here for help obtaining some development ECU's we are already in the process to add an ability to read and write map data into the TDV6 & TDV8 EMS.

13th Aug 2007 1:34 pm

Flaps30GearDown

Member Since: 03 Sep 2007
Location: Sussex
Posts: 3

I say chap's.

Postings here seem a tad harsh. I've been lingering for a while but never really needed to post my two tuppence worth.

Seem's someone has a grievance with BBS SPY & his products. Such a shame it's get's shouted out above the rooftops.

Any manufacturer of anything electrical has the same associated problems it seem's, when the problem lie's with the operater. Of course, things can go wrong & generaly do, but i know that 90% of such complaints stem from unfamiliar use. For example, how many of you in this forum can operate their washing machine proficently or those damned microwave ovens. I know i have trouble.

But i can use & understand Blackbox's products, I had system errors & all sorts appear, but with there manuals & a little patience you do get to understand the principles behind the hardware & that's when you realise the awesome functional ability's these products purvey.

I've had a few dealings with blackbox, emails alway's answered, query's alway's established, but never ever have i found any of there product statements to be untrue.
I was told that " it'll be one of the best things i've ever bought". That statement i will back as 100%.

As for the price of his products, it takes a very stupid person to complain, especialy as they have more than one option as to who supply's their diagnostic gear.

BBS SPY should indeed be gratulated for spending the time to answer your queries & problems on this site. To respond back with derogatory comments is a mere sign of ignorance towards a guy who has developed & marketed a diagnostics system that not only matches it's rivals but indeed beats it hands down.

Colin, i take my hat off to you.

Regards.

3rd Sep 2007 12:38 pm

catweasel

Member Since: 05 May 2006
Location: Bundaleer
Posts: 4805

Flaps30GearDown wrote:
I've been lingering for a while but never really needed to post my two tuppence worth.

so why wait 3 weeks to sign up and respond and with any product questions will be and have been asked

maybe you need to contact your microwave manufacturer for some tips and open up a dialogue

3rd Sep 2007 1:23 pm

DrLex

Member Since: 15 Jul 2005
Location: Ciderspace [Oi be in Zummerset]
Posts: 4863

Flaps30GearDown wrote:
...Colin, i take my hat off to you.

Regards.

If you're taking things off, your apostrophe key and your flimsy disguise could follow... Time flies like an arrow; fruit flies like a banana

Member of Club Med Sucks