Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50934
Not sure I've not answered
Seems it's the net profit rather than income. It's not only the crown estate that evolved from lands acquired by conquest or by just taking it though is it ...and ultimately who owns it and who has free and fair access to it all?
20th May 2018 11:28 pm
gstuart
Member Since: 21 Oct 2016
Location: kent
Posts: 13635
didn’t release that E type jag was electric , yeh i know i’m slow
Member Since: 31 Dec 2005
Location: South West
Posts: 23366
DG wrote:
Not sure I've not answered
Seems it's the net profit rather than income. It's not only the crown estate that evolved from lands acquired by conquest or by just taking it though is it ...and ultimately who owns it and who has free and fair access to it all?
Look back at the questions in my posts on page 6.
It was income from the Crown Lands that George III surrendered to Parliament, but yes the Crown Estate, as it's been known since 1961, now pays the net revenue profit to The Treasury, some £2.6bn over the past 10 years (up to 206/17).
You'll struggle to find many countries where in the past lands weren't not taken by right of conquest.
Free and fair access? All welcome to picnic and party in the grounds of "The Gaff" I assume? Maybe next weekend 2006 D3 HSE (Original & still the best)-GONE
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21st May 2018 5:15 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50934
LT wrote:
You'll struggle to find many countries where in the past lands weren't not taken by right of conquest.
By conquest ...or just taken. ...isn't it called 'ill gotten gains'
You referred to equality and in the context of my general view of equality I replied "All I seek is equal opportunity ..some will choose to take it ...others won't" I didn't say that the royals denied others of it... you did ...but I guess of course that if the layman wanted to be royal or hold a hereditary title he couldn't ...he is denied of it....so in a way there's your answer.
The gaff is bought and paid for btw...not taken, nor acquired
Any other questions that I've missed?
21st May 2018 6:06 pm
Pelyma
Member Since: 06 Jan 2005
Location: Patching, Sussex
Posts: 15496
LT wrote:
DG wrote:
Not sure I've not answered
Seems it's the net profit rather than income. It's not only the crown estate that evolved from lands acquired by conquest or by just taking it though is it ...and ultimately who owns it and who has free and fair access to it all?
Look back at the questions in my posts on page 6.
It was income from the Crown Lands that George III surrendered to Parliament, but yes the Crown Estate, as it's been known since 1961, now pays the net revenue profit to The Treasury, some £2.6bn over the past 10 years (up to 206/17).
You'll struggle to find many countries where in the past lands weren't not taken by right of conquest.
Free and fair access? All welcome to picnic and party in the grounds of "The Gaff" I assume? Maybe next weekend
Australia, Canada, USA, much of South America, much of Africa all stole land from the indigenous people so I guess you’re right, these are on the whole countries that are regarded more as mertocracies, albeit for many still retaining our monarchy so perhaps stealing property is far more common.DS3 TDV6 HSE - Silver with Alpaca (old one) Gone
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21st May 2018 6:43 pm
RRSTDV8
Member Since: 07 Apr 2014
Location: Here
Posts: 13099
LT wrote:
Free and fair access? All welcome to picnic and party in the grounds of "The Gaff" I assume? Maybe next weekend
Of course, all land in this country is effectively "stolen" and "ill gotten". It was taken by Bill the b d in 1066. He took it all in his name and then gave bits out to his mates. Those that lived on it before then lost the lot. Since then, there has been a gradual trickle down of that land to the population in general. But it's all "stolen" land to start with.
One might also point out that people benefitting from huge increases in house prices over the last 20+ years have "stolen" from those yet to come. Many are unable to now afford to own their own property as a result. A generation has got fat and enjoyed a lavish retirement at the expense of those following on. That's worse than a few Royals spending a couple of bob on a shindig, in my opinion.Visiting from rrsport.co.uk
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21st May 2018 8:33 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50934
Yep we could argue that but then any subsequent reform benefited the crown first and foremost ...and unlike you, me or most ..they haven't had to buy any land.
Ultimately, my view remains to keep them for entertainment and revenue value ...but make them self sufficient ...and return all excess land for the enjoyment of all
21st May 2018 10:22 pm
RRSTDV8
Member Since: 07 Apr 2014
Location: Here
Posts: 13099
Define "excess" in the land bit.
Would you make the "excess land" in to public parks? What about the arable land etc? Who should farm that?
Anyway, they inherited the land in just the same way as people inherit houses from their parents in the rest of the country. Perhaps we should impose a limit on what people can inherit? Perhaps we should say that massive value gains are unfair and prevent "equal opportunity" in the property market? You paid £X for The Gaff but I bet it's worth a multiple of X now. Is that "fair"? Does that remove "equal opportunity" from others who can't afford to buy similar properties because of price inflation? Let's trim off that "excess value" and make it available to everyone... Visiting from rrsport.co.uk
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"When you fire that first shot, no matter how right you feel, you have no idea who's going to die! You don't know who's children are going to scream and burn. How many hearts will be broken. How many lives shattered. How much blood will spill, until everybody does what they were always going to have to do from the very beginning: SIT DOWN AND TALK!"
21st May 2018 11:31 pm
DG Site Moderator
Member Since: 12 Dec 2005
Location: The Gaff
Posts: 50934
Well excess could be defined by us ...and run by government for whatever reason is seen fit. I wouldn't want to see them homeless ....like some in Windsor
As for inherited property ...you miss the point that Royal and hereditary class has inherited the estates from zero acquisition cost. Equal opportunity in a market driven property system now is unfortunate ...but we can identify the point cause of this if we wind back 34 years
21st May 2018 11:51 pm
Pelyma
Member Since: 06 Jan 2005
Location: Patching, Sussex
Posts: 15496
But only zero acquisition cost because they’ve not needed to move, if we all lived in our parents house’s we’d have zero acquisition costs, don’t forget many of these that do move down the generations are owned by the National Trust or other charity so are IHT exempt. Still not sure what ”access” you want though? Is it to look around, live there, walk over the land etc?DS3 TDV6 HSE - Silver with Alpaca (old one) Gone
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22nd May 2018 6:14 am
Mogwyth
Member Since: 03 Oct 2014
Location: Pwllheli
Posts: 3976
The queen only has two private estates Balmoral and Sandrigham, both purchased, the former by Prince Albert and the later by Victoria for the then prince of Wales, Edward the VII. Everything else she has benefit of Is Crown property.==================================
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22nd May 2018 6:33 am
Someone-Gone
Member Since: 21 Dec 2015
Location: Gone
Posts: 5117
Anyway, it detracts from the moralistic argument to reform or abolish the monarchy. Clearly, the die hard Royalists aren’t going to agree although id hazard a guess that they are now be in a minority. Change will come with time, like it or not.
22nd May 2018 6:58 am
Mogwyth
Member Since: 03 Oct 2014
Location: Pwllheli
Posts: 3976
2017 opinion polls had roughly 2/3 In favour of keeping the Monarchy, not seen anything more recent.
Also remember reading somewhere that of the major economic countries per head of population we had one of the cheaper and more respected heads of state.==================================
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22nd May 2018 7:23 am
Mogwyth
Member Since: 03 Oct 2014
Location: Pwllheli
Posts: 3976
Ps i an not a royalist, i just look at other countris and wonder at times if an elected president is really any better and often the answer is no.==================================
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22nd May 2018 7:25 am
professorpool
Member Since: 19 Mar 2012
Location: Woking
Posts: 3213
DG wrote:
By conquest ...or just taken. ...isn't it called 'ill gotten gains'
Don't visit the British Museum then - it's basically all stuff we have robbed and pillaged over the years. D3 07 SE - still going strong
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