Member Since: 13 Nov 2021
Location: U.K.
Posts: 12
Thinking of buying a D4 vs L322 vs Landcruiser vs L405
Hello everyone, I’ve always really liked the D3/D4 but never owned one but have had L322s before, my last one being an early TDV8.
I think the D4 is a better looking vehicle and more practical but the one thing that is really worrying me about getting one is the horror stories I keep hearing about the V6 engine, while I’m used to the various pitfalls of LR ownership like air suspension, bushes,suspension arms and tyres being on the heavier side of use etc an engine failure that would cost thousands to sort is a step too far so was just wondering how common the issue is and if there are any preventative steps someone could take to minimise the risk?.
My budget would be up to about £22k for whatever I buy next but I could possibly push it a bit in the case of an L405 so weighing up a D4 vs the other options really.
Like I say I love the looks and practicality of the Disco and honestly I’d prefer one over another L322 but the final version of that with the 4.4 engine does make a compelling case too both in a better the devil you know way and the 4.4 engine not suffering the potential crank issues.
An early L405 would be a bit of a budget stretch and would be hard to get something so upmarket covered in mud and tow with etc but at the same time it does have the advantage of being a generation newer and probably drives better than any of the others.
Lastly before you all recoil in horror at the very thought of it I’m also considering a 150 series Landcruiser LC5, they come pretty well specced and I know they’re not going to have any problems but they just don’t look as nice as the D4 either inside or outside plus on paper they are miles behind in terms of power and I’d think refinement too being a 4 pot vs a V6!.
Just looking for some advice really about what to look out for and how common engine issues are, are there any specific warranties that cover them no quibbles?, I’m assuming I’d need one with full LR history and no Indy’s for that?.
13th Nov 2021 12:41 pm
popsdosh
Member Since: 09 Nov 2009
Location: cambs
Posts: 442
From experience avoid a D4 unless you already have sleepless nights . The same engine in a disco five is not being as troublesome. You can pick up a early 5 for possibly less than a late 4 . There is no warranty that will cover a D4 with a Broken crank not even approved used LR as they use their get out of jail free card. Only hope is Good will from JLR and that will need a full JLR history .
15th Nov 2021 9:37 am
LT
Member Since: 31 Dec 2005
Location: South West
Posts: 23326
My L405 gets used as my D3/4’s were. It actually cost less than my last new D4 Landmark. I’ve lined the boot out with a hatchbag liner and LR rubber mat. Rubber floor mats all round. Going to get some seat covers this winter, I think.
The D3/4 is more practical and versatile and at times I do miss the vast boot space, but the L405 isn’t exactly small!
I didn’t warm to the D5. I had one for over 12k miles, I just didn’t get the grin factor. Each to their own though. 2006 D3 HSE (Original & still the best)-GONE
2010 D4 HSE (A bit bling)-GONE
2014 D4 HSE (Almost too bling)-GONE
2015 D4 HSE (A heated what?)-GONE
2016 D4 Landmark (Written Off)-GONE
2016 D4 Landmark (Surely the last!) PD1881 rims-GONE
2017 FFRR SDV8 Autobiography
15th Nov 2021 9:58 am
robpenrose
Member Since: 12 Jan 2016
Location: Surrey / SW London
Posts: 2136
popsdosh wrote:
From experience avoid a D4 unless you already have sleepless nights . The same engine in a disco five is not being as troublesome. You can pick up a early 5 for possibly less than a late 4 . There is no warranty that will cover a D4 with a Broken crank not even approved used LR as they use their get out of jail free card. Only hope is Good will from JLR and that will need a full JLR history .
The early D5 engine is terrible. I would avoid that.
Current: D4 HSE
Previous: BMW Z4M Coupe
Previous: Land Rover Defender 90 CSW Td5
Previous: Land Rover Discovery Td5 ES
15th Nov 2021 10:08 am
popsdosh
Member Since: 09 Nov 2009
Location: cambs
Posts: 442
Its the same engine in a lighter vehicle . dont confuse with the 4 pot bus engine.
15th Nov 2021 10:20 am
robpenrose
Member Since: 12 Jan 2016
Location: Surrey / SW London
Posts: 2136
Correct, it's the same basic engine, but it's a single turbo and suffers from oil dilution.
They went back to the twin turbo setup after a year or two. TDV6 Disco 5 is a single turbo, SDV6 is twin-turbo. SD6 is a straight 6 new engine. (Disco 4 is different badging again)
I personally wouldn't touch a single turbo D5, but would be happy with the newer engines.
I also don't get why people mention the weight. They are all rated to tow 3.5 tons, a few hundred KGs weight saving isn't going to make much difference.
There is also a number of RRS/FFRS/D5s that have had blown 3.0 engines, so it isn't just the D4 or D3.
Current: D4 HSE
Previous: BMW Z4M Coupe
Previous: Land Rover Defender 90 CSW Td5
Previous: Land Rover Discovery Td5 ES
15th Nov 2021 10:40 am
SB100
Member Since: 13 Nov 2021
Location: U.K.
Posts: 12
I much prefer the look of the D4 than D5, plus if I were going to spend out on a D5 I think I’d rather get an L405 with the V8 diesel.
Has anyone driven the similar age Toyota?, would be great to hear your thoughts, although I think I’m more likely to go the L322 or L405 route.
15th Nov 2021 3:16 pm
forest66
Member Since: 04 Jan 2021
Location: Lymington
Posts: 84
as much as i hate to say it the land cruiser prob wont have the issue landrover seem to have
15th Nov 2021 3:21 pm
CongoBoy
Member Since: 05 Mar 2019
Location: Wiltshire
Posts: 525
I've always used Land Cruisers for work in Africa. The diesels are a straight six, either turbo'd or not and the petrol are a V8. Do not confuse the Land Cruiser Prado or Hilux as a proper Land Cruiser.
Toyota keep them simple spec for Africa and they are mechanically diff locked and transfer locked (except the simple cabin) and we normally fit winches on them.
Depending on spec, its either one tank of 130 litres or two that are 90 and 60. They are very basic compared to Discos and FFRR but get the job done but cannot be compared for comfort cruising on highways etc.
Whilst I apprecaite them for work in Africa, I personally wouldn't run one here in UK with that spec.
Prados and Hilux are a different matter.
Just my two cents worth.2008 D3 HSE Stornoway Grey (UK)
2008 D3 HSE Izmir Blue- South African Spec. (Zimbabwe)
2005 FFRR SC V8- Java Black
1995 D1 300 Tdi Blue - (Sourced from the UK, shipped to Namibia, driven by me to RD Congo, then Zambia, now retired in Zimbabwe)
15th Nov 2021 5:58 pm
nigel207
Member Since: 26 Mar 2009
Location: Nottinghamshire
Posts: 1344
I have driven several incarnations of Landcruisers at an annual Tow Car event. They might not break (allegedly, although I have a friend who owned a 2004 model from new that destroyed its engine bottom end, so…….), but they are awful on the road and verging on being dangerous steering/handling wise when towing. To be honest, IF you enjoy driving, I wouldn’t entertain a Landcruiser. But, that’s my opinion.
As for the 3-litre JLR engine, whilst we hear the horror stories (and I can’t help having it at the back of my mind at times) when you consider the number that have been produced compared to the number that have failed, I suspect the percentage is very small. However, one failure is one too many, but as above, even this with a supposed unburstable reputation, on occasions……..
15th Nov 2021 7:30 pm
SB100
Member Since: 13 Nov 2021
Location: U.K.
Posts: 12
The one I meant is the baby Landcruiser by international standards I think, there’s a comparison article with the D4 so this is the variant I meant:
D4 seems to be miles ahead in terms of refinement, interior, power and looks but the Toyota I know is super reliable but a bit, I really don’t want to say soulless as it’s a bit of a cliche but it seems a bit dull and underwhelming, in terms of ability I’m sure both of them are great I just think I’d rather risk the D4.
Why couldn’t they have done it with the TDV8?!, it would stop all that worry!.
As much as I like them I think it might have to be an L405 SDV8.
Just got to justify the cost and try and find one in blue or green without blacked out windows!.
Then part of me thinks I could risk a D4, the percentage of failures can’t be that high as there are a lot of them on the roads, it was the same when everyone said the turbos would fail at some point on my L322, I changed the oil regularly, let it idle down after it had been on boost and checked the inter cooler pipes regularly, in the time I had it-it was fine!.
15th Nov 2021 8:01 pm
lynalldiscovery
Member Since: 22 Dec 2009
Location: Maidstone
Posts: 7274
Mate has an older landruiser colorado, 285k so far original engine/injectors, gbox has been rebuilt, but the chassis is rusty everywhere, top shock mount has just sheared off.
They do seem capable of serious miles, they also seem to hold their value very well.
15th Nov 2021 10:11 pm
popsdosh
Member Since: 09 Nov 2009
Location: cambs
Posts: 442
SB100 wrote:
Then part of me thinks I could risk a D4, the percentage of failures can’t be that high as there are a lot of them on the roads, it was the same when everyone said the turbos would fail at some point on my L322, I changed the oil regularly, let it idle down after it had been on boost and checked the inter cooler pipes regularly, in the time I had it-it was fine!.
My exact thoughts when I went back to Landrover last year. Sadly from experience they are a form of Russian Roulette its an inherent weakness in the crank . Hopefully will get mine back this week with a new engine LOL as I said in another thread the dealer has 4 more lined up needing new engines . If you want to avoid serious cost buy from a franchised dealer and hope for JLR goodwill( as approved warranty wont cover it) or your cheaper D4 will look very expensive . I know where there is one done 67k miles with new MOT and 2yrs engine warranty coming up for sale 😉😂
16th Nov 2021 9:26 am
CIO
Member Since: 06 Mar 2018
Location: Bahrain
Posts: 109
SB100 wrote:
The one I meant is the baby Landcruiser by international standards I think, there’s a comparison article with the D4 so this is the variant I meant:
That's known as the Prado in most markets. We have a Petrol 4L V6 Prado and a Petrol 3L SC V6 Discovery 4 (aka LR4) here and there's really no comparison to driving comfort between the two. The Prado is fairly agricultural compared to the Disco and (at least the petrol version) is incredibly slow. Frankly, reliable or not, I'd hate to be driving a Prado in the UK.
Stick to a Land Rover for the UK is my advice Chris
--
2016 D4 Landmark in the UK. 2014 LR4 SE in Bahrain.
16th Nov 2021 1:49 pm
SB100
Member Since: 13 Nov 2021
Location: U.K.
Posts: 12
popsdosh wrote:
SB100 wrote:
Then part of me thinks I could risk a D4, the percentage of failures can’t be that high as there are a lot of them on the roads, it was the same when everyone said the turbos would fail at some point on my L322, I changed the oil regularly, let it idle down after it had been on boost and checked the inter cooler pipes regularly, in the time I had it-it was fine!.
My exact thoughts when I went back to Landrover last year. Sadly from experience they are a form of Russian Roulette its an inherent weakness in the crank . Hopefully will get mine back this week with a new engine LOL as I said in another thread the dealer has 4 more lined up needing new engines . If you want to avoid serious cost buy from a franchised dealer and hope for JLR goodwill( as approved warranty wont cover it) or your cheaper D4 will look very expensive . I know where there is one done 67k miles with new MOT and 2yrs engine warranty coming up for sale 😉😂
That sounds interesting, if I do decide to risk going the D4 route I really want either a green or blue HSE, not fussed about it being Euro 6 as with my budget I doubt I’d get one and any reason not to have to go anywhere near London is good enough for me!.
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