Member Since: 11 Nov 2013
Location: Canberra
Posts: 209
EGT monitoring using diagnostic tool
i am wanting to monitor EGTs but don't want to install new equipment gauges etc when the car (2.7) already has a sensor. I tow a caravan so once I learn what style of driving causes spiked EGTs I will probably not even bother looking at the gauge. Would also need to monitor when crossing ranges or hilly areas.
As a fall back I will probably just use my IID BT when needed. So a couple of questions.
The IID should not be left connected permanently - is it safe to leave it connected for say 10min, 1 hour? What happens to it ... Does it cook itself or the car??
Is there another option to access the existing sensor and render it 'live'. Can other diag tools by left connected full time and render the live values?
26th Jun 2017 12:46 am
garrycol
Member Since: 06 Dec 2010
Location: Canberra
Posts: 1115
The ECU monitors EGT and if starts to get out of parameters the ECU changes operating perameters to reduce it, so in a D3 you really do not need to monitor it but agree it would be nice to know what it is doing when towing in hilly country - however the ECU can make decisions quicker and better than you will be able to.
If you do get a gauge - more than likely, while EGTs may get a little higher than normal you will not observe it outside parameters because the ECU has already taken action to reduce it so you will only ever see the end result.
Garry
26th Jun 2017 2:38 am
BrettKaz
Member Since: 11 Nov 2013
Location: Canberra
Posts: 209
I am on to my 3rd engine due to over-fueling so the EGT's must have spiked for that to happen without correction from the ECU. My engine has been re-mapped but I assume the engine protection was not erased in the process.
Gary... PM coming your way.
26th Jun 2017 8:03 am
Bodsy Site Sponsor
Member Since: 06 Nov 2006
Location: In the Clubhouse
Posts: 21361
Some of the remaps just chuck a load more fuel in, instead of managing the whole engine measurement and management.
Was it a cheap remap is usually a good indicator of the type of remap you may ave had. Also how long ago? As diesel remaps have come a long way over the last few years. Bodsys Brake Bible
Clock/ SNOTM /3Flash / 4x4Info /BT Update /Service Reset/Error Codes / Gearbox Reset See It Here
26th Jun 2017 9:30 am
BrettKaz
Member Since: 11 Nov 2013
Location: Canberra
Posts: 209
Tried to get the most recognised decent map down here called R00 Systems. Believe me it wasn't cheap and would pay more to keep my previous engine/s if that was a guarantee. When I phoned them and said that I had lost an engine due to over-fueling... they said that I was the first customer that it has happened to. I didn't believe it when it was tatoo'ed on the 'butt' of a casual liaison I once shared the evening with ("you're the first") and I didn't believe when they told me that.
You're theory of course has merit - towing heavy Caravans (3t) exposes any weaknesses in the overall EMSystem. In all fairness engine#1 I think was failed injector - which I could have been more on top of. That's why I am broadly anti-remapping and went for what what I considered a conservative map - unfortunately I was sort of locked into it with my van selection and D3 and 440 standard Nm. If I had an SD D4 I would left it as is.
I figure LR have 10 PHD engineers twisting knobs/calibrating tuning - a lot of tuners have a website, a 2:2 degree in marketing and the keys to the fuel 'go' switch. I am sure BAS are different - I admire people that stand behind their product - just not down here in AUS so flying a bit blind. Thanks for the follow-up post.
Why don't one of you BAS guys emigrate down here?
26th Jun 2017 10:37 am
BrettKaz
Member Since: 11 Nov 2013
Location: Canberra
Posts: 209
The re-mapping was done 9 months ago.
26th Jun 2017 11:05 am
Sidestick
Member Since: 22 Apr 2012
Location: Rome
Posts: 2288
i used to leave the iidtool BT up to 8/10 hours trips with no issues,
i like to monitor up to 8 parameters (usually EGT,Oil temp,Autobox oil temp,torque converter etc)
from my experience, towing a caravan needs to close monitor the autobox behaviour,
i usually switch to manual shift and take the engine not below 2100 rpm on long distance legs,
it helps to keep lower temp at all and the torque converter closed instead of modulated - Easy-Lift suspension module 4.0
- GoodWinch 9500 lb
- Full underbody protections
- Tree/Rock sidebars
- Prospeed roofrack & ladder
- Compressor guard
- Raised Air Intake
- Driving lights (2+4)
- 50 mm Waffle boards
- Altox Heater control
- Overland Rooftop Tent
- Rear seats entertainment
- Front & Rear camera
- GVIF
- Removable tow bar
- Cubby box fridge
- BFG KO2 265/65R17
- iidTool BT
26th Jun 2017 11:09 am
Pete K
Member Since: 15 Jan 2016
Location: GL
Posts: 10362
You can leave the IID connected while the car is running.
The biggest worry is you not kicking it with your foot.
But you can certainly do that for 1 trip.
26th Jun 2017 12:09 pm
BrettKaz
Member Since: 11 Nov 2013
Location: Canberra
Posts: 209
Thanks for the responses – a couple of lessons to be learned…
1) Interesting point about locking up the TC at 2100 ... I that equates to 100kph in 5th. 100kph is about 1800 revs in 6th. If this proves correct for my vehicle then I think I need to re-re-map - peak HP is at 103kmph or 1800 revs in 6th (then falls off a cliff) and peak torque is generally declining from about 1200revs but falls off a little more at these revs. So my mapping is tuned to 100kmp in 6th not 100kmph in 5th. LESSON #1 if you are getting a towing map for loads over 2T and have to tow in 5th (to lock-up the TC) then get them to adjust your map accordingly.
2) My IID does not seem to get hot but it gave me a hell of a fright when I went for the brake pedal and couldn’t find it (my foot hit the IID). LESSON #2 don’t wear CROCs while driving with IID inserted (or maybe any other time)
3) Just a reminder of the trigger function on the IID if you are monitoring EGT’s. Pretty handy… can set off alarm if they get too high.
Thanks for the feedback I am now 'drive by IID'. The only problem I'll have is not running off the road while monitoring all the data.
Attached is my dyno remap results which also have standard map on it for those interested - just annoying that the horizontal axis is in KMPH and not rev's. (100kph is about 1800 revs) Values are at the wheels which is why they seem lower than advertised.
Click image to enlarge
29th Jun 2017 6:17 am
lynalldiscovery
Member Since: 22 Dec 2009
Location: Maidstone
Posts: 7274
Does anyone know what the egt at max torque are for a 2.7tdi?
I realise theres many variables just curious as to what people have seen?
29th Jun 2017 7:08 am
Sidestick
Member Since: 22 Apr 2012
Location: Rome
Posts: 2288
Just some tips,
- your best "pulling" is obtained at maximum torque value, not at max power, so around 80 to 85 on your graphic,
- the graphic is made in 4th gear because is the closest gear to obtain a 1:1 gear ratio on the bench
- benches are able to measure only the torque (they are just dynamometers), then this equation is applied to calculate power:
P (Kw) = [C (NM) X RPM ] / 9549
where
P: power in Kilowatt
C: torque in Newton/meter
RPM: round per minute
9549: constant of conversion
1Kw = 1,34102 CV
- the autobox logic will go to "modulate" the torque converter as soon your rpm will fall below the maximum torque value, a good increase is obtained in sport mode, but best is to use the manual gear shift
- try to look at the live values on the iid in the autobox section to find out when your torque converter remain "close" or when it goes "modulated", you will find a new world
Regarding EGT on my Disco, it runs around 320°C at highway speed (110 km/h), but here in europe since 2008 our cars run DPFs and during the cleaning cycle the EGT rise over 600°C for 15 to 20 mins.
Final tip: buy an OBD port extender, unmount your OBD receptacle (2 screws), joint the extension cable and fit it inside the glowbox...you will run without to be warned if you wear Crocs or not - Easy-Lift suspension module 4.0
- GoodWinch 9500 lb
- Full underbody protections
- Tree/Rock sidebars
- Prospeed roofrack & ladder
- Compressor guard
- Raised Air Intake
- Driving lights (2+4)
- 50 mm Waffle boards
- Altox Heater control
- Overland Rooftop Tent
- Rear seats entertainment
- Front & Rear camera
- GVIF
- Removable tow bar
- Cubby box fridge
- BFG KO2 265/65R17
- iidTool BT
29th Jun 2017 8:43 am
Pete K
Member Since: 15 Jan 2016
Location: GL
Posts: 10362
Yeah you should move the dish port. Pleople of later models do it for security.
Not difficult.
29th Jun 2017 9:15 am
BrettKaz
Member Since: 11 Nov 2013
Location: Canberra
Posts: 209
Great responses thx - it's beer-o-clock here but I think tomorrow I need to check if my D3 does 115kmph in forth to re reference my map to forth gear! Hope she's got it in'a.
29th Jun 2017 9:25 am
garrycol
Member Since: 06 Dec 2010
Location: Canberra
Posts: 1115
I have had a BAS map for about 5 years and not had any issues. When giving my requirements to Pete, I indicated that I was not interested in HP but wanted max torque at 100kph - for towing and normal overtaking. With a national speed limit of 110kph (Open on one 200km stretch) HP is not so important but overtaking torque at 100kph is.
When ROO systems was all Toyota I would have been wary of them and their early systems were just over fuelling systems but the owner has changed to a D4 3.0 and I understand it is a proper remap - but not sure of their experiences with a 2.7.
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