Member Since: 29 Nov 2006
Location: North Yorkshire
Posts: 15213
Good point there Dave
And if I can add, if you do also tie the bow/stern of your kayak/canoe to your vehicle, make sure you tie at both front and rear, with equal tension.
Tying at just one point will have the effect of pulling the boat off in that direction [as tension is only at the one end].
Also, make sure you protect the paintwork of your vehicle by adding foam at appropriate points between the rope and body.I was a normal heterosexual chap, but in these new woke awakenings I now identify as a Wardrobe.
6th Jun 2020 9:44 am
ronp
Member Since: 29 Nov 2006
Location: North Yorkshire
Posts: 15213
For those confused with the difference between a canoe and a kayak.
swmbo is forever calling my canoe a kayak and my kayak a canoe.
A canoe is generally 'open top' with no bow/stern/port/starboard decks.
Key side to side strength is generally only the yoke and/or thwart.
It's paddled with a single blade paddle.
mine: Mad River Explorer 14TT
Click image to enlarge
With a kayak it has a closed cockpit and you sit inside, then pull over a spray deck to seal [which the paddler wears around their waist], exception being a 'sit on top' kayak which is self explanatory.
Kayaks are much stronger than open top canoes as they're generally one peice plastic moulded, and they have integral top decks, [they can have addittioal strength added for whitewater use ie internal hull spine and uprights between the hull and decks.]
Its paddled with a double bladed paddle.
mine: Pyranha Burn [white water] Mk2
Click image to enlarge
I was a normal heterosexual chap, but in these new woke awakenings I now identify as a Wardrobe.
6th Jun 2020 10:02 am
waterbuoy
Member Since: 26 Oct 2013
Location: Argyll
Posts: 2862
Trailered Movements wrote:
Just a bit of advice, and not only relevant to canoes/kayaks.
The nylon straps have a woven finish, not smooth. When under tension they will bite into whatever is being strapped meaning one side might be taught, and the other less so.
Using a sleeve over your goods that the strap goes through allows the strap to tension uniformly. A piece of carpet will do the same, you want the strap to move but the point of contact to remain staionary.
Dave
Agree - we often use lay flat hose to sleeve our ratchet straps with Currently 2009 Disco 3 SE, 2013 MY D4 HSE and 2016 D4 SE
Previously:
TD5 Defender 110 CSW (230k miles)
300TDi Disco 1 (289k)
4 RR Classics (300-350k each, 2 manual, 2 auto)
110 V8 CSW (220k)
S3 109 hi cap pickup (ex RN)
S2A 88 Safari SW with lpg conversion (bloody lethal)
6th Jun 2020 10:28 am
JMack
Member Since: 02 Aug 2014
Location: Edinburgh
Posts: 1517
I use ratchet straps on to the roof bars, roof bars well spaced on long roof rails.
I also have a set of triangular stops which prevent any chance of going off either side or front and back.
Click image to enlarge
6th Jun 2020 2:31 pm
Peakwayfarer
Member Since: 25 Apr 2016
Location: Uk
Posts: 434
This is Canadian canoe on the discovery, sadly longer owned by us - the D4 not the canoe!
6th Jun 2020 3:15 pm
Ben4
Member Since: 28 Apr 2017
Location: Buckinghamshire
Posts: 934
@peakwayfarer - is that made from carbon fibre? very cool looking! 8)
think a sleeve for the ratchet or some carpet bits seems like a sensible idea
Thick foam sections to go between roof rack and upside-down canoe seems a good idea as well - need something to level out the roof with the other stuff up there already:
I'll be making something like this:
Click image to enlarge
@waterboy - got any pics of the formers you made please? and a bit more detail on the climbing tape you mention as I'm still not 100% sure on how to tie down the front without rubbing the pain on the bonnet
Thanks everyone
Ben
formerly Disco3Ben
2016 D4, Santorini Black
2007 D3, Black - sold
6th Jun 2020 4:16 pm
JMack
Member Since: 02 Aug 2014
Location: Edinburgh
Posts: 1517
For the climbing tape, I'm presuming he means some sort of webbing. Used for tree slings or similar in climbing.
I've read of people bolting a loop to each wing with a loop of 'tape' sticking above the bonnet and tying from each to the front of the canoe. /\ style.
Obviously for vehicles with bolt on wings. Not seen it done on a discovery though.
6th Jun 2020 4:48 pm
Peakwayfarer
Member Since: 25 Apr 2016
Location: Uk
Posts: 434
[quote="Disco3Ben"]@peakwayfarer - is that made from carbon fibre? very cool looking! 8)
think a sleeve for the ratchet or some carpet bits seems like a sensible idea
Thick foam sections to go between roof rack and upside-down canoe seems a good idea as well - need something to level out the roof with the other stuff up there already:
[img:533:400]https://www.disco3.co.uk/gallery/albums/userpics/52122/normal_IMG_1996.JPG[/img]
I'll be making something like this:
[img:826:400]https://www.disco3.co.uk/gallery/albums/userpics/52122/normal_Screenshot_2020-06-06_at_16_08_03.jpg[/img]
@waterboy - got any pics of the formers you made please? and a bit more detail on the climbing tape you mention as I'm still not 100% sure on how to tie down the front without rubbing the pain on the bonnet
Thanks everyone
Ben
:D[/quote]
Yes it is carbon fibre and it’s from Canada, also very light, which is a bonus for lifting and carrying. The ratchet straps I use are very soft with a soft almost suede tab behind the ratchet, so no damage noted so far, you can’t see it on the photo but where the canoe makes contact with the roof rack there was pipe insulation or similar on the bars to minimise any damage, used carpet initially but it became horribly soggy when it rained
6th Jun 2020 5:06 pm
waterbuoy
Member Since: 26 Oct 2013
Location: Argyll
Posts: 2862
We rig cableways as part of our business so have literally dozens of slings of different sizes and types. One of the suppliers we use is Flint Theatrical, and they sell 25mm sewn slings in a variety of lengths
The former is/was just a rectangular(ish) shell/frame that we stood up inside the canoe and covered the top corners with foam to prevent it punching through. The idea was to try and prevent deflection (ours was a polyethylene canoe - I think Mad River - that we found washed up on the beack so it was far from perfect!)
It might be that when you build your canoe you can incorporate a couple of additional lightweight frames into the hull at the point where you will be strapping it down. That would avoid the need for the formers.Currently 2009 Disco 3 SE, 2013 MY D4 HSE and 2016 D4 SE
Previously:
TD5 Defender 110 CSW (230k miles)
300TDi Disco 1 (289k)
4 RR Classics (300-350k each, 2 manual, 2 auto)
110 V8 CSW (220k)
S3 109 hi cap pickup (ex RN)
S2A 88 Safari SW with lpg conversion (bloody lethal)
6th Jun 2020 6:09 pm
BeardManMatt
Member Since: 09 Feb 2020
Location: Tamworth,Staffs
Posts: 54
Ben,
How do you get on with getting an open onto your ProSpeed rack?
Is there much room to get anything else on after? another Kayak or a Bike maybe?
Id really like a ProSpeed but with some much invested in Thule racks and carriers im reluctant to change if I can't get everything I want on the roof.
cheers
22nd Jul 2020 7:37 am
Ben4
Member Since: 28 Apr 2017
Location: Buckinghamshire
Posts: 934
Hey Matt,
Haven’t built the canoe yet! End of the month.
I’ve got the material to make tie down loops.
Ordered dense foam blocks for the roof so I can leave the ladder transport racks fitted to the roof and still tie down the canoe.
Prospeed rack is 128cm wide
The canoe I’m making is 90cm wide
If the thinking is not to use ratchet straps then I need to sort something else and also have a think about what to use as the front and back tie down lines?
Cheers
Benformerly Disco3Ben
2016 D4, Santorini Black
2007 D3, Black - sold
22nd Jul 2020 10:07 pm
Ben4
Member Since: 28 Apr 2017
Location: Buckinghamshire
Posts: 934
Just arrived in Ullswater.
Fitted a front tie down loop before I left:
Although I reckon it’s surely going to rub the paint when the canoe line is tied down?formerly Disco3Ben
2016 D4, Santorini Black
2007 D3, Black - sold
30th Jul 2020 10:46 pm
Ben4
Member Since: 28 Apr 2017
Location: Buckinghamshire
Posts: 934
Ended up making the canoe a little wider than initially planned - still about 4.5m long and now 1m wide.
Think it would fit up there without having to put the awning upright, just need to move the fixing eye bolts.
I put 2 large long blocks of foam across the whole width of the roof rack so the canoe pulled down on to those and not half on half off the ladder rack.
formerly Disco3Ben
2016 D4, Santorini Black
2007 D3, Black - sold
4th Aug 2020 9:20 pm
BeardManMatt
Member Since: 09 Feb 2020
Location: Tamworth,Staffs
Posts: 54
Looks great,
Is this the boat you've made?
Loving the prospeed rack. I might have to step up my interest in one.
5th Aug 2020 4:03 pm
Ben4
Member Since: 28 Apr 2017
Location: Buckinghamshire
Posts: 934
yes - that's the canoe I made last week formerly Disco3Ben
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