Advertise on DISCO3.CO.UK
Forum · Gallery · Wiki · Shop · Sponsors
DISCO3.CO.UK > Technical (D3)

Torque converter on way out or something else at play...?
Post Reply  Down to end
Page 1 of 2 12>
AJ198T
 


Member Since: 24 Jul 2015
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 60

United Kingdom 2005 Discovery 3 4.4 V8 SE Auto Bonatti GreyDiscovery 3
Torque converter on way out or something else at play...?

Hi all, i have what seems from reading various posts like a worn torque converter (juddering uphill), but a few other things are at play which cloud the issue a bit so just wondered if anyone has any pointers to clarify what’s going on. 2004 D3, petrol V8, 190k. Excuse the long post, I’m no mechanic and want to give all info in case relevant/helpful…

1. Last month it started sometimes vibrating on motorway, like being sat on washing machine on fast spin, thrumming not shuddering. Thoughts were TC, prop, or sticking caliper. Squeaking wheel sound kicked in after long runs but increasingly shorter runs (squeal stopped as soon as brake pedal applied) and vibration at times when braking. Mechanic suspected sticking caliper (more dust on alloy on that side too) but on inspection said it was the carrier and replaced that and the brake pads (o/s had worn down to nearly nothing despite a recent change). But whilst braking is now improved and no more motorway vibes, squeal still occurs even on short runs now and still stops if brakes even slightly applied or if turning wheel more to right. Haven’t been able to detect heat from disc so no sticking caliper or not sticking when I've checked for heat. CV?

2. Separately, been trying to chase down a fairly minor issue which seems to be an elusive vacuum leak - sluggish at lower revs, readings show running lean under initial acceleration, bit rough around 1500 revs where the lack of power seems to be, sucking noise etc, no EML (new PCV, EGR, manifold gaskets but still no joy, investigations to be continued when time allows...)

3. Meanwhile, car has started slightly kangarooing up some hills sometimes, revs rise and fall but more like a surge than the 'fluttering' I've read about. Cannot replicate rev fluctuations or juddering in any other load or condition, even if trying to labour the engine (including up hills), just happens on some hills and seemingly in the rev range described in issue 2. Gearbox had a megaflush about 5k ago and all changes are smooth and silent, no clunks, bangs, jerks etc.

My initial thought about where the heck to start is try Dr Tranny and if the hill juddering stops I know it's probs the TC and I’ve bought some time and the other issues are unrelated to it. Could worn CV cause the squeaking/hill juddering? Could the vacuum leak or other fuel issue cause the rev wavering and hill juddering? it will be going to mechanic but want to try and point in the right direction if poss. Any thoughts and experience welcome and cheers for reading the above mini essay, AJ
  
Post #225157415th Sep 2021 10:20 pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Mr Kington
 


Member Since: 12 Dec 2011
Location: Scottish Borders
Posts: 1549

United Kingdom 2005 Discovery 3 TDV6 HSE Auto Siberian SilverDiscovery 3

No mechanic but it sounds like you have different issues with the car. Dr Tranny is the best bet for the TC as a short term fix. If it goes then that’s the culprit. Won’t be cheap to replace though.
 James favourite hobby is writing in the third person.  
Post #225160316th Sep 2021 7:10 am
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
aja4x4
 


Member Since: 14 Apr 2019
Location: Westbury
Posts: 2459

United Kingdom 2005 Discovery 3 TDV6 SE Auto Zambezi SilverDiscovery 3

I would start by looking at your engine and getting that running right, a small misfire or hesitation under load will be multiplied by the torque converter.
 Andrew

D3 2.7tdv6 2005
D4 3.0 SDV6 Commercial died and gone to LR heaven
D5 3.0 SDV6 HSE 
 
Post #225160416th Sep 2021 7:24 am
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
desv8
 


Member Since: 01 May 2020
Location: CHELTENHAM
Posts: 124

United Kingdom 2005 Discovery 3 4.4 V8 HSE Auto Buckingham BlueDiscovery 3

Check pipe from the air filter to throttle body they are known to crack/split. Check how clean the throttle body is. MAF sensor fault can cause hesitation at lower revs. Is there any difference between the car being hot or cold, check gearbox level? Check the centre bearing on the rear prop they can cause vibration at speed.
  
Post #225175616th Sep 2021 7:07 pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
AJ198T
 


Member Since: 24 Jul 2015
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 60

United Kingdom 2005 Discovery 3 4.4 V8 SE Auto Bonatti GreyDiscovery 3

Thanks chaps. Maf has already been checked and throttle body cleaned. New pcv and egr helped a little as both were leaky but main issue has persisted. Will check hose from filter to TB myself and ask mechanic to as well although it has been smoke tested, I assume that hose would have been checked but can't say for sure. There is a gruffness present circa the 1500rpm area when cold but less so when hot but power is a bit lacking whether hot or cold.
  
Post #225179116th Sep 2021 10:43 pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
AJ198T
 


Member Since: 24 Jul 2015
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 60

United Kingdom 2005 Discovery 3 4.4 V8 SE Auto Bonatti GreyDiscovery 3

Just a follow up. Compared mine with another V8 and both sounded the same so the sucking noise must just be normal intake sound. Predictably there were no hesitant spots when we did a comparison drive, both cars drove much the same despite very different mileages (sub 100k vs mine at 180k). Still getting slight roughness if I rev it after initial startup, possibly more so now its cooler weather, and occasional hedutancy when out and about so the issue perisists but is no biggie.

Meanwhile, I enquired about new TC and was advised despite the box being very smooth and well behaved in all other respects the mileage means they wouldn't do just a new TC and only recommend a full rebuild (£3.3k). So I followed the forum advice and had a mega flush done first, assuming it was unlikely to help as only had one done less than a year ago, and the recent juddering got bad fast and seemed beyond what I expected Dr Tranny could resolve.

Well, it's now completely fine. No judders and rev counter needle rock steady. The garage spotted a weep on the box so it could be that the level was low, or the Dr Tranny has done the trick for now and bought me some time to save a bit more for a box refurb. Either way the forum has proven its worth yet again, for which I'm grateful.
  
Post #226207614th Nov 2021 10:58 am
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
desv8
 


Member Since: 01 May 2020
Location: CHELTENHAM
Posts: 124

United Kingdom 2005 Discovery 3 4.4 V8 HSE Auto Buckingham BlueDiscovery 3

Sounds like a great result. Thumbs Up

I was given the same advice reference the TC. The specialist would not just change the TC without a gearbox overhaul on a 190k box.

Out of interest do you know when the plugs were last changed.
  
Post #226210614th Nov 2021 2:06 pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
V8man
 


Member Since: 01 Jan 2021
Location: Dunno i was just following the satnav😳
Posts: 288

Ukraine 2007 Discovery 3 4.4 V8 HSE Auto Cairns BlueDiscovery 3

Good news aj
Glad you've got that bit sorted at least Thumbs Up
 1996 Defender -died (now in landrover heaven😇)chassis to ashes , rust to dust !
2004 Defender td5 gone
2012 Evoque gone
2007 D3 V8 HSE 
 
Post #226211014th Nov 2021 2:17 pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
AJ198T
 


Member Since: 24 Jul 2015
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 60

United Kingdom 2005 Discovery 3 4.4 V8 SE Auto Bonatti GreyDiscovery 3

Have you had your autobox overhauled then desv8?

Plugs were changed the service before last along with air filter after I first noticed the issue and no change. Also had new egr and pcv which helped but didn't eradicate. New intake manifold gaskets also made no diff. I belive other things checked and seem OK are: coil pack, fuel pressure, injector firing (but injectors not removed and tested as yet). And no error codes apart from some of the usual bcm ones about pedal motors etc.

It's nothing major so I can live with it for now or until it becomes apparent enoigh to diagnose and fix. Just annoying to sometimes get tdv6 performance for v8 mpg haha. I love the car though so I'll forgive it and even sort its box for 3k when the time comes.
  
Post #226211914th Nov 2021 2:39 pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
desv8
 


Member Since: 01 May 2020
Location: CHELTENHAM
Posts: 124

United Kingdom 2005 Discovery 3 4.4 V8 HSE Auto Buckingham BlueDiscovery 3

I only get hunting at low revs from cold AJ. I had a gearbox flush done which made the box smoother but still hunting from cold. I had it road tested by Bristol Transmissions who could not fault it, although the box was warm at the time.

Once up to temperature the car drives faultless with no judder/hunting, up hill, down hill, with TA caravan on the back, no issues. So with 192k on the clock don't want spend out until absolutely necessary.

I had hesitation issues with my v8 D2. No fault codes. I was told they only identify a code once a certain miss fire count is logged. Very fustrating but tracked it down to coil packs. D3's have a coil per cylinder so possible one is breaking down under some conditions.
  
Post #226212614th Nov 2021 3:02 pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
robsta
 


Member Since: 19 Mar 2011
Location: La Lucia, Durban
Posts: 52

South Africa 2011 Discovery 4 5.0 V8 HSE Auto Alaska WhiteDiscovery 4

Hello

Just a follow up on the engine noise. Is the noise present at idle, and goes away when the revs get to about 1300Rpm?

I ask because my D4 V8 had an issue, and it was the vacuum valve that manages the pressure within the crankcase. I think they called it a "symposer. I had mine replaced and it went away.

As for the TC, I had to do the Dr Tranny and flush, did the software updates and its been ok for about 15000km. But during the holidays, towing a heavy trailer I suspect its on its way back.

I do however have a noisy tappet noise which is present when the engine is hot, and at idle. The Landy guys don't really know what it is....Not always present, but when its there you can actually feel the noise / shudder from the engine through the whole car.

I am sitting at 236000km on my V8. Any thoughts?
 Previously Freelander II
Previously '08 Disco 3 TDV6 SE
Previously '10 Disco4 TDV / SDV6 HSE
Now: '12 Freelander II SD4 HSE -
Now '11 Disco4 V8 HSE 
 
Post #227366519th Jan 2022 1:06 pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
desv8
 


Member Since: 01 May 2020
Location: CHELTENHAM
Posts: 124

United Kingdom 2005 Discovery 3 4.4 V8 HSE Auto Buckingham BlueDiscovery 3

I've read that the 5lt V8 used in the Range Rover suffers with timing chain guide issues. Not sure if the D4 has the same engine. loads on the WWW about it.
Good Luck
  
Post #227376219th Jan 2022 8:02 pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
kajtzu
 


Member Since: 10 Aug 2017
Location: Helsinki
Posts: 6538

Finland 2005 Discovery 3 4.4 V8 HSE Auto Cairns BlueDiscovery 3

Yes, the D4/LR4 5.0 liter V8 does have an issue with timing chain guides and tensioners. Ideally, they need to be replaced. If they fail the end result is catastrophic for the engine.

See https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2015/MC-10104461-9340.pdf
  
Post #227376619th Jan 2022 8:15 pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
robsta
 


Member Since: 19 Mar 2011
Location: La Lucia, Durban
Posts: 52

South Africa 2011 Discovery 4 5.0 V8 HSE Auto Alaska WhiteDiscovery 4

Hello

Sorry....I did not mention. I did my chain etc at 186000km.

So the list of items done:

Chains and tensioners - 186K
Control Arms AND tie-rod Ends - 195K
Control arm bearings 198K
Rear Propshaft OEM - 220K
Symposer / Vacuum control - 195K
Plastic water housing top and rear of engine - 220K
Fuel sensor / fuel pump in the fuel tank - 230K
Both front wheel bearings and front discs and pads...232K

All done by The Center Land Rover Durban SA

Back to this snag: I started the car this morning. Super smooth and no noise, but by the time I left the house 5 minutes later the clanking was back. It sounds like valves, or cam seats on the valves. but very intermittent. As soon as I give the slightest revv to about 1000RPM its gone. If I come to a stop then also gone, but then starts about 2 minutes later. I am also thinking it is oil related. Maybe an oil jet not clear...maybe a good flush? I have also changed oil to the Castrol EDGE Titanium 5W-60W.

Pulling my hair out!
 Previously Freelander II
Previously '08 Disco 3 TDV6 SE
Previously '10 Disco4 TDV / SDV6 HSE
Now: '12 Freelander II SD4 HSE -
Now '11 Disco4 V8 HSE 
 
Post #227387520th Jan 2022 12:06 pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
AJ198T
 


Member Since: 24 Jul 2015
Location: Sheffield
Posts: 60

United Kingdom 2005 Discovery 3 4.4 V8 SE Auto Bonatti GreyDiscovery 3

Hi Robsta

Sorry, not been on for a bit. The D3 seems fine now. No squeaking from brakes, gearbox buttery smooth and pulls steady in all conditions and I've done plenty of long haul trips since the flush (there's a small weep on the box so possibly the oil was just a bit low), and the engine seems generally lively and responsive. I also took it down to see another forum member with a V8 and despite his having much lower miles they drove without any discernible difference (he drove both mine and his back to back for a direct comparison). In reward for good behaviour I've just treated it to four new OEM air struts with shocks (180k on the originals so was deffo due). Cheers for the info about the symposer though, always useful to know these things in case of future issues.
  
Post #227615331st Jan 2022 1:37 pm
View user's profile Send private message View poster's gallery Reply with quote
Display posts from the last:  
Post Reply Back to top
Page 1 of 2 12>
Jump to:  
Previous Topic | Next Topic >


Posting Rules
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum



DISCO3.CO.UK Copyright © 2004-2024 Futuranet Ltd & Martin Lewis
DISCO3.CO.UK RSS Feed - All Forums

DISCO3.CO.UK is independent and not affiliated to Land Rover.
Switch to Mobile Site