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Nasher
Member Since: 07 Mar 2009
Location: Clanfield, North of Pompey - UK
Posts: 2686
  
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Looks like it’s my turn 
First off, apologies for the length of this initial post. I’ll describe the symptoms I’ve had, what I’ve found, and then ask the collective wisdom for opinions.
The car is a 55 plate D3 HSE with 108K on the clock and I’ve owned it for 18 months.
A couple of weeks ago I was happily driving along when on braking I had the classic Bong, Orange Light, and ‘Normal Height Only’ error message. Stopped the car, started it again, dropped it to Access height then all the way up to Off Road and all was fine. After 18 months of D3 ownership I’ve got used to odd error messages that never come to anything.
On Thursday lunchtime it happened again, but when I reversed the car into my space at the office car park I noticed I had a brake light out, and having spent too much time on this forum I thought that must be the reason. So I stopped at Halfords on the way home and replaced the bulb in the car park. Job done thought I, as I’d used Halfords Brake Light bulbs in the D3 before and not had any problems. Although on previous occasions a blown Brake Light Bulb has given me a ‘Special Programs Unavailable’ message.
Then yesterday, Friday, just cruising along the motorway to the boat show I had the Bong, Orange Light, and ‘Normal Height Only’ error message. Again, turning it off when I came to my junction, and restarting sorted it out, and I thought I’ll try some Land Rover Bulbs on Monday when the dealer is open.
Today, Saturday, it’s happened 3 times, twice within about a mile of each other, and it’s stopped reacting to height changes as it should all the time.
Sometimes it lifts straight up as if nothing is wrong, other times the rear end lifts straight up then the front comes up very slowly and I’ve had two ‘new’ messages.
Firstly something like ‘Suspension Raising Slowly’ and second ‘Suspension will Raise when the system cools down’.
It is however switching on and off, so I’ve sort of discounted the relay, and it’s no more noisy than it’s ever been.
My first port of call was obviously to search this forum, and have a good read of Disco_Mikey’s Thread about replacing the Compressor. Looks like a relatively simple job if the bolts come undone and the pipes release.
So out I went to crawl under the car and have a look to see if there was anything obvious like a leak.
The first thing I noticed was the cover centre bolt head wasn’t there, and I found after removing the cover that the bolt is sheared off in the bracket and will need to be drilled out.
Nothing appeared to be too amiss, apart from it was all an awful lot hotter than I thought it would be.
Thinking that I’ll soon have to be stripping it out I thought I’d have a quick look to see where the mounting bolts are and give them a quick blast of WD40 in preparation.
I was getting a bit frustrated because as hard as I looked I just could not see the head of the top mounting bolt, and thought I must be looking in the wrong place. Then it struck me, the reason I couldn’t see it was because it’s just not there! I can see a light Blue painted clip for a captive nut, but whoever’s been in there before obviously thought the top bolt was just too awkward to replace 
So, what do we reckon, Compressor about to give in? Or should I be looking elsewhere?
Should I completely discount the possibility of it being a bulb?
I’ve seen mention of a Valve/Block at the front, could this be the cause as it’s slow to react at the front?
Any other suggestions before I splash out on a Compressor?
I assume to strip the compressor out I need to drop it to Access height to release the pressure?
Will a new compressor need any sort of electronic setting up that I can’t do with spanners etc?
Thanks
Nasher. Heaven doesn't want me, and hell is afraid I'll take over.
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 24th Sep 2011 10:12 pm |
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Kingmav66
Member Since: 20 Jul 2010
Location: Gloucestershire
Posts: 1349
 
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A friend of mine had something like this recently. We stripped out the compressor, pulled it apart and found the con-rod broken. He owns a company restoring historic racing cars, so is used to re-manufacturing things. So he machined a new one, rebuilt and worked fine. Also we replaced the relay 
I'm sure i read somewhere on here, that you can get some kind refurb kit and new dryer for the compressor.
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| 24th Sep 2011 10:41 pm |
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Nasher
Member Since: 07 Mar 2009
Location: Clanfield, North of Pompey - UK
Posts: 2686
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Thanks Kingmav66, the compressor is still running, and sounding OK, so I don't think it can be a broken rod.
Having read a bit more on the forum I may try to replace the air dryer before I go any further.
Anyone know the part Number?
Thanks
Nasher Heaven doesn't want me, and hell is afraid I'll take over.
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| 25th Sep 2011 1:00 am |
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character
Member Since: 01 Jan 2008
Location: wiltshire
Posts: 5781
 
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TBH your first few paragraphs have the same symptoms as me a few months ago, exactly the same 
I too had a brake light out and used a non LR one, next day after 50 miles same error messages etc. Happened to be near salisbury LR so got a LR one and replaced it straight away. Got another 8 miles down the road and hey presto, same error message again.
So turned around and headed back to LR dealer, enjoyed their hospitality for an hour, diagnosed the vehicle was "ossiliating" on the air suspension (printed off the fault codes etc) and asked me whether it had been tracked recently which of course it had been only a few weeks earlier by an inde LR.
Anyhow, recalibrated the suspension/steering sensors there and then and off I went for another few days, then same again with the error messages of "faulty transmission/AT not available and suspension lowering" which like you clears after letting the vehicle sleep. On arrival at LR dealers then related the issue to a faulty height sensor and on further investigation found it to be the NSR.
So had all 4 done at the same time (to be on the safe side), needed to re-track it anyway (this time correctly as visually you could see the camber was out on the rear) and had it all set up as it should be...........guess what, fine for a number of weeks and still drives like a dream today.
But a few weeks later and a few 1000's miles later did the same, "fault codes the same etc" but after letting it go to sleep and re-starting it would drive no problems for 100's of miles then again error messages.
Spoke to dealer whilst on the hardshoulder one friday afternoon and then drove it 50 miles to them but he did ask exactly what was I doing prior to the thing throwing up the messages and guess what like you "WHEN BRAKING" - which has 85% answered the question for yourself
When plugged in could clearly see a number of faults both historic and current but by cross refferencing them to the date and approx mileage, THE ONE THAT STOOD OUT was infact the culprit, THE BRAKE SWITCH 
Moral of the story... dont guess it, get it into a LR dealer to put on IDS to confirm but when it does it again, make a note of the date/time and mileage as this will show up the exact fault codes, however as a man who's been there seen it done it, would recon to be 85% brake switch (costs around £25 and 20 mins to fit if that) or faulty height sensor/s which are'nt very expensive but needs to be plugged in to confirm either/both 
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| 25th Sep 2011 1:38 am |
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SpiderBaby
D3 Decade
Member Since: 21 Sep 2007
Location: Liverpool
Posts: 1399
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If you're reasonably sure it's the compressor then it's relatively cheap to overhaul before you buy a new one.
Getting it off is straight forward - like you the centre bolt on my cover had snapped off - when the compressor is off it's a simple drill out and replace with a bolt.
My top mounting bolt was also missing - seems a common occurrence because it's so awkward.
1. Change the relay - £5
2. Get the compressor overhaul kit - £4.50
3. Get new captive nuts and bolts for the compressor bracket - £2
4. Dismantle and dry the silica gel in the compressor dryer - £0 (or buy new dryer - £70)
5. Remove NSF inner wheel liner - find the three wiring blocks towards the rear - two grey, one blue - separate them, clean carefully, dry any moisture, pack with an electrical grease (or Vaseline....) to prevent further moisture ingress
Took me around three and an half hours work cleaning etc as I went. Tools required - 10mm & 8mm spanners, 10mm socket and longish extension, 17mm socket (for installing overhaul kit), cross head driver for opening the dryer and, most importantly, patience. I see no ships........
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| 25th Sep 2011 10:52 pm |
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caverD3
Member Since: 03 Jul 2006
Location: Oberon, NSW
Posts: 6922
 
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Before doing anything more complex change the dryer or remove it's contents and microwave them before replacing.
Easy to do and it solved the issue with mine. “There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely gamesâ€
Ernest Hemmingway
D4 3.0 Active Diff, Adaptive Lights, High Beam Assist, Surround Cameras, Privacy Glass.
D3 2.7:Adaptive Headlights,Electronic Rear Diff,ARB Bar,Blaupunkt Speakers,JVC Powered Subwoofer,Removable Snorkel,Mitch Hitch,Pioneer After Market Head Unit,Steering Wheel Control Adaptor,Remote Adjustable Supension Rod System, Taxside Dual Battery System.
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| 26th Sep 2011 1:35 am |
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Nasher
Member Since: 07 Mar 2009
Location: Clanfield, North of Pompey - UK
Posts: 2686
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Thanks for your replies guys.
Spiderbaby, it was one of your replies to an earlier thread that prompted me to spend some time yesterday investigating further and drying out the Silica Gel as per your instructions. It didn’t go exactly according to plan, partly as I dived into it on a Sunday without taking any notice of you guys as to what I might need to replace.
Luckily I have quite a well equipped workshop at home, so managed to put everything right.
I just wish I’d taken some pictures as I went along, but got so involved I didn’t, sorry.
Actually getting the assembly off the car wasn’t too hard as somebody had already left out the top mounting bolt.
The two feed pipes were a bit stubborn, the brass collets would not move at all, so I had to spend some time flushing round them with WD40 and freeing them off with a pair of pliers before I could push them in to release the pipes. I didn’t want to cut them if I could get away with it.
The first real issue was that just as everyone had said the captive nuts/clips disintegrated. Being Sunday, and needing the car for work today, I ended up making some, but made them in Stainless so they don’t do it again. Luckily I had some 1mm Stainless sheet and some nuts to weld on, so 20 mins with the Pillar Drill and Stainless wire in the Mig put that right.
Next, the self tapper, which goes through the smallest of the three places where the compressor mounts to it’s bracket, sheared off flush with the surface. The other two ‘proper’ mounts came out OK. Whoever designed a self tapper in that location needs shooting, closely followed by the Procurement engineer who signed off a cheap piece of cheese like rubbish for production.
Anyway, I drilled it out, and went right through so I could put a Stainless nut and bolt in.
Next up was what I’d taken the thing off to do in the first place, rejuvenate the dryer.
Getting it off was a complete pain. The screw came out, but it proved very difficult to turn and pull off it’s ‘Bayonet’ fitting.
The reason for this was obvious once it was off. The Aluminium stub was very corroded, and the ‘O’ring had broken down into a glue like mess, which coupled with the Aluminium oxide had glued the plastic housing to the outlet stub.
Once cleaned up I was a bit worried about the Aluminium outlet stub, as quite a lot of the bit past the ‘O’ ring was actually missing, but I put a new ‘O’ ring in anyway and hoped for the best. I used a Nitrile rubber one that I had in stock, and is if anything a bit too big in section, but with a slight smear of silicone grease it gave a satisfying tight fit when put back together.
At this point I tried to blow through the dryer, and found it impossible.
From previous posts on here I half expected the dryer to burst Silica Gel beads all over the place as I opened it up, but found that the contents were packed so hard that after the top and spring were off I had some difficulty in removing the top filter. The beads poured out OK, but the bottom filter had to be knocked out using a bar through the inlet.
The beads were full of powder so I retired to the kitchen and sieved them to separate the powder, then stuck them in the microwave spread out on a ceramic plate to remove the moisture. I lost count of how many times I put them on for a minute, but I had LOADS of steam, and they turned a nice translucent blue/purple when the steam eventually stopped.
I put it back together, but was concerned that the paper filters are clogged with dust and are impeding air flow, but I could at least blow through it afterwards. I’ll be ordering a new one this week.
Assembling it all again was easy, apart from I forgot the steel wire(What does that do?) and had to start again.
I then replaced the three mounting bolts with Stainless ones and had a bit of a swear getting the top one in.
I had a very minor leak from the ‘Blue’ outlet, but sorted that by breaking and making the joint again.
I’m very pleased with the results so far, I’ll have to drive it for a few days and put some miles in to see if I get any Bongs etc, but the dryer was obviously slowing it down as the suspension is raising so much quicker than it ever has in my possession, and the compressor is running for a much shorter time at start up and after using some air.
To cap it all, I thought I’d keep an eye on ebay for another Compressor to put in stock ready for the inevitable.
In amongst the £350 to £427 new ones, I found one that had been swapped out of a D3 and the new one hadn’t cured the problems the owner had. It looks very clean etc in the pictures, and I thought it worth a risk at £49.95 Buy it now, especially if I put a new dryer on it.
If I was using the car off-road a lot, or using it in a very humid environment, I would remake the Aluminium bracket in two parts, so that one part could be bolted to the car before the Compressor and lower part was bolted to it. This could also enable the dryer to be changed without removing the whole assembly from the car.
Nasher. Heaven doesn't want me, and hell is afraid I'll take over.
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| 26th Sep 2011 2:18 pm |
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SpiderBaby
D3 Decade
Member Since: 21 Sep 2007
Location: Liverpool
Posts: 1399
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Nasher - glad you got it sorted
I'm a believer in trying to repair / refurb rather than just throwing something away and fitting a new one.
Only other thing I did was clean, dry and seal the three connections under the NSF wheel arch as I do off-road and thought it best to do them as well.
I like your idea of having a split bracket - let us know what comes of that idea.
Like you I drilled out the broken middle cover bolt and put a stainless one right through. I see no ships........
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| 26th Sep 2011 2:57 pm |
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Nasher
Member Since: 07 Mar 2009
Location: Clanfield, North of Pompey - UK
Posts: 2686
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SpiderBaby wrote:
Like you I drilled out the broken middle cover bolt and put a stainless one right through.
Oh yes, forgot that bit, did that as well.
What I described above was actually one of the three fixings holding the Compressor etc to the Bracket.
Nasher Heaven doesn't want me, and hell is afraid I'll take over.
Last edited by Nasher on 27th Sep 2011 7:52 am. Edited 1 time in total
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| 26th Sep 2011 3:00 pm |
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caverD3
Member Since: 03 Jul 2006
Location: Oberon, NSW
Posts: 6922
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The bracket is easily corroded so I cleaned and painted mine when I had the compressor out. 
Although they dont corrode as much here as we don't need to use salt on the roads.  “There are only three sports: bullfighting, motor racing, and mountaineering; all the rest are merely gamesâ€
Ernest Hemmingway
D4 3.0 Active Diff, Adaptive Lights, High Beam Assist, Surround Cameras, Privacy Glass.
D3 2.7:Adaptive Headlights,Electronic Rear Diff,ARB Bar,Blaupunkt Speakers,JVC Powered Subwoofer,Removable Snorkel,Mitch Hitch,Pioneer After Market Head Unit,Steering Wheel Control Adaptor,Remote Adjustable Supension Rod System, Taxside Dual Battery System.
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| 27th Sep 2011 2:43 am |
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Nasher
Member Since: 07 Mar 2009
Location: Clanfield, North of Pompey - UK
Posts: 2686
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Update.
All has been well since I dried out the silica gel in the dryer, but as of yesterday morning I’m back to the ‘Bong – Suspension fault, normal height only’ situation. 
On the way to work I had the error message, so I turned the ignition off at the next set of lights and continued with no more problems.
On my way home I made it about a mile from work and I had the message again so pulled over into a layby.
I swapped the compressor relay with the one from the heated windscreen and made sure the compressor turned off after a short while when the car was restarted.
I made it the rest of the way home, about ten miles, with no problems.
Just to make sure, a bit later on I swapped the relays over again and went out for a test drive.
Sure enough, I got about a mile from home and had the error message.
I swapped the relays over again and continued for @5 miles with no problems.
Great thought I, down Guy salmon for a new Relay tomorrow afternoon, Sorted.
That was until this morning. About a mile from home I had the now familiar Bong etc.
I managed to stop a couple of times, but each time only managed about a mile before ‘Bong’.
I’m going to try a new relay anyway, and maybe swap in my spare compressor this evening, but it’s driving me mad.
Any suggestions? Apart from torching the car.
Nasher Heaven doesn't want me, and hell is afraid I'll take over.
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| 14th Oct 2011 8:54 am |
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SpiderBaby
D3 Decade
Member Since: 21 Sep 2007
Location: Liverpool
Posts: 1399
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Nasher - have you checked the three connectors behind the NSF wheel arch lining? Especially if you off-road and drive through water.
It's a half hours work to do and I would suggest it's worth a go before you change the compressor again (unless you know it's completely shot - but I guess it raises and lowers OK?)
With the wheel off the liner is held on by an assortment of screws and push fittings - probably less than a dozen or so in total.
Once you can see the connectors (towards the back of the arch), clean then carefully, dry them, check for corrosion and then re-connect them - I would pack them with an electrical grease (or possibly Vaseline).
If they're badly corroded then do as Pete Bell has suggested and remove the connectors and remake them. I see no ships........
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| 14th Oct 2011 9:07 am |
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Grunders
Member Since: 30 Apr 2011
Location: Manchester
Posts: 2302
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I still think the brake light switch or bulbs may be a contributing factor..... For around £25 quid and 20 minutes works its easy to sort out.....
Only my opinion though..... If it ain't broke... Take it apart anyway, how else you gonna find out how it works
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| 14th Oct 2011 9:42 am |
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Nasher
Member Since: 07 Mar 2009
Location: Clanfield, North of Pompey - UK
Posts: 2686
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Thanks for all your help guys.
I’m lucky enough to finish work mid afternoon on Fridays, so my plan is to spend some time trying to sort this out.
I’m going to stop at Guy Salmon and buy a new relay anyway, plus some genuine LR brake light Bulbs.
As a bit of preventative maintenance I’ll probably have a look behind the wheel arch liner and clean/seal the connectors.
If that appears to sort it out, I’ll probably stop short of swapping the spare compressor in, as like SpiderBaby suggests it is going up and down quickly and I’d rather keep it for when it’s really needed.
What’s the story with the brake light switch?
Is it expensive? Easy to swap over etc?
I also need to put a new outer gaiter on the offside front driveshaft, and renew the front anti-roll bar bushes before it’s MOT next week.
But I have all the parts for those already.
Nasher. Heaven doesn't want me, and hell is afraid I'll take over.
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| 14th Oct 2011 10:15 am |
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Grunders
Member Since: 30 Apr 2011
Location: Manchester
Posts: 2302
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The brakelight switch is around a tenner, it takes minutes to fit, i found access is easier if you remove the large panel below the steering column, it's only held in with clips... If it ain't broke... Take it apart anyway, how else you gonna find out how it works
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| 14th Oct 2011 10:35 am |
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