Member Since: 21 Oct 2016
Location: kent
Posts: 13640
hi pat
great info as always to know
9th Aug 2017 12:32 pm
Alphamale
Member Since: 28 May 2014
Location: Belfast
Posts: 496
That's certainly a lot simpler than the LR process and the way to go.
All you're looking for is; Standard height at front and rear, measured from the centre of the drive shaft to the highest point of wheel arch trim to be: 466mm and 485mm respectively. From those base measurements, access height should be 50mm lower and extended height 55mm above. As pat says with the GAP tool you don't need level ground, but it helps.
Sorry for the delayed reply gent's, been a bit busy with other stuff!
Thank for the comments Pat
So i pulled the F26 for 24 hours. no change to height.
I've measured the base height from the ground to wishbones on a level surface & everything seems to match across axles.
Now I've calibrated the suspension a number of times with the IId Tool. If i use the guided method I seemed to struggle to get consistent results. I'd measure around the vehicle to get the required heights at each corner, complete the process & then reactivate the EAS. Raising to off road & returning to normal would result in the nearside of the vehicle dropping about 15mm lower than the offside. It was wasn't returning to the original position, overall the vehicle would be much higher than it should be for normal mode.
I had better success with the manual calibration method for some reason. I could enter offsets than meant I could level the vehicle, set the correct height front & rear, re activate the EAS drive the vehicle from the spot i calibrated it, raise & lower the suspension, return to the original spot, re measure & get the results I expected. Happy days, or so i thought!
A few days later, the missus takes the car out for a run, returns it to the driveway, now it's leaning the other way, no as bad as it was in the original picture on the garage forecourt, but it's leaning!
As the sensors have all been changed, mechanically no obvious problems & no errors or warning apparent i'm thinking either the compressor is getting tired & needs replacing as it is the orignal from what i can make out & does take some time to pressurise the system once a height adjustment has taken place or the wiring is causing an intermittent reading of some sort.
Given hunting down a wiring problem is the cheaper option, I'll have a look through the forum & find the threads relating to wear & pinch points on the loom for the EAS.
The saga continues
Cheers NickMY16 D4 Landmark SDV6 (The Ice Maiden)
Uncle Ray's spare wheel protector
MY08 D3 HSE Stornoway (Miss Moneypit) The money tree withered......
18th Aug 2017 9:18 pm
PatGAPInnov Site Sponsor
Member Since: 02 Dec 2011
Location: Montreal
Posts: 745
You're welcome.
Quote:
I'd measure around the vehicle to get the required heights at each corner, complete the process & then reactivate the EAS.
Just to be sure, the guided calibration does not require you to get the vehicle level during the process. As per the user manual notes:
• It is normal for the opposite corner to move when adjusting the height of a corner. This does not
affect in any way negatively the calibration.
• It is normal for the vehicle to be crooked during calibration. Once the process is completed, the
suspension will adjusts the vehicle accordingly.
• Using a fabric tape measure taped to the centre of the wheel will allow operation of the App
while measuring and ensure more consistent measures.
• Depending on the vehicle and axle, it is easier to control either the up or down motion. Use the
less precise as the starting point then adjust more precisely.
• Marking the centre of the wheel does help with consistent measures
• Calibration of all corners is done in one iteration. Once a corner is calibrated, its calibration
will no longer be affected by movements induced by other corners being calibrated.
I suggest reading the instructions since it will affect the results significantly if not done right.
Also, the manual calibration does not require compensating. Calculations are made in order to get the right values. Compensating manually will result in a bad calibration and symptoms you are describing. The user manual is your friend...
Member Since: 21 Oct 2016
Location: kent
Posts: 13640
Skagg wrote:
Sorry for the delayed reply gent's, been a bit busy with other stuff!
Thank for the comments Pat
So i pulled the F26 for 24 hours. no change to height.
I've measured the base height from the ground to wishbones on a level surface & everything seems to match across axles.
Now I've calibrated the suspension a number of times with the IId Tool. If i use the guided method I seemed to struggle to get consistent results. I'd measure around the vehicle to get the required heights at each corner, complete the process & then reactivate the EAS. Raising to off road & returning to normal would result in the nearside of the vehicle dropping about 15mm lower than the offside. It was wasn't returning to the original position, overall the vehicle would be much higher than it should be for normal mode.
I had better success with the manual calibration method for some reason. I could enter offsets than meant I could level the vehicle, set the correct height front & rear, re activate the EAS drive the vehicle from the spot i calibrated it, raise & lower the suspension, return to the original spot, re measure & get the results I expected. Happy days, or so i thought!
A few days later, the missus takes the car out for a run, returns it to the driveway, now it's leaning the other way, no as bad as it was in the original picture on the garage forecourt, but it's leaning!
As the sensors have all been changed, mechanically no obvious problems & no errors or warning apparent i'm thinking either the compressor is getting tired & needs replacing as it is the orignal from what i can make out & does take some time to pressurise the system once a height adjustment has taken place or the wiring is causing an intermittent reading of some sort.
Given hunting down a wiring problem is the cheaper option, I'll have a look through the forum & find the threads relating to wear & pinch points on the loom for the EAS.
The saga continues
Cheers Nick
hi Nick
sorry to hear ur still having a headache
don't know what the more experienced guys think but could a faulty reservoir valve possibly allow it to lean to one side
i.e. if it was letting by , the air is slowly creeping into the air tank, does seem as u mention reports of wire issues , i.e. front passenger side wheel arch and passenger rear wheel arch
hope u get it sorted out mate , sorry thats not much help , as i imagine it's driving u nuts
I'd measure around the vehicle to get the required heights at each corner, complete the process & then reactivate the EAS.
Just to be sure, the guided calibration does not require you to get the vehicle level during the process. As per the user manual notes:
• It is normal for the opposite corner to move when adjusting the height of a corner. This does not
affect in any way negatively the calibration.
• It is normal for the vehicle to be crooked during calibration. Once the process is completed, the
suspension will adjusts the vehicle accordingly.
• Using a fabric tape measure taped to the centre of the wheel will allow operation of the App
while measuring and ensure more consistent measures.
• Depending on the vehicle and axle, it is easier to control either the up or down motion. Use the
less precise as the starting point then adjust more precisely.
• Marking the centre of the wheel does help with consistent measures
• Calibration of all corners is done in one iteration. Once a corner is calibrated, its calibration
will no longer be affected by movements induced by other corners being calibrated.
I suggest reading the instructions since it will affect the results significantly if not done right.
Also, the manual calibration does not require compensating. Calculations are made in order to get the right values. Compensating manually will result in a bad calibration and symptoms you are describing. The user manual is your friend...
Cheers
Hi Pat,
I've got a hard copy of the manual for EAS calibration from your site as well as the manual calibration sheets which i'd read & followed for the guided calibration. Setting the height from wheel centre to arch using masking tape as a central reference point to 466 front, 485 rear. Once i'd achieved the right measurements for each corner following the app, i uploaded the settings to the car & it would appear ok until i reactivated the EAS, it would raise & lower but return to an overall height higher than i'd expect it to be after calibration but also the leaning would return.
This was the reason for changing to the manual calibration method.
Fortunately I have access to a concreted area that is level at all angles so this at least removes uneven ground from the equation.
I really don't know why it's doing it, it's got me stumped MY16 D4 Landmark SDV6 (The Ice Maiden)
Uncle Ray's spare wheel protector
MY08 D3 HSE Stornoway (Miss Moneypit) The money tree withered......
Just for info, I've re done the suspension calibration again today using the manual method.
First i used the Right wheels as reference, then the left. Attached are the calculations & first measurements i dialed in.
Left side
Right side
I presume this calibrates the front & rear across the axle, then using the base height setting you can get the 466 for the front & 485 for the rear which is what i have done using the height adjust option in the app by setting the front to -5 & the rear to +15
Height Adjust
Currently it seems to be correct, i'll monitor it ove the next few days of use to see what happens......
Keep you posted MY16 D4 Landmark SDV6 (The Ice Maiden)
Uncle Ray's spare wheel protector
MY08 D3 HSE Stornoway (Miss Moneypit) The money tree withered......
It feels like i'm going around in circles with this problem!
So since the last update, I've re-calibrated the suspension several times (now using tight tolerance mode) every time i complete the process & run the car on a short road test & check everything seems in order. Give it a day or so though & the nearside (mainly the rear) is visually 1/2" lower than the offside. It's not slowly dropping overnight, it's apparent when the vehicle is both in motion & stationary.
It was MOT'd today & the tester pointed it out to me, though there were no obvious signs underneath anything that wasn't right.
I posed the problem to my local LR dealer last week when it was in for new EGR's & they suggested it "might" be the rear crossover valve worn?
One thing I have noticed is if you sit in the car long enough with the engine running it will suddenly adjust itself as though self leveling. When it does it it's not subtle. This leads me to wonder if a valve perhaps a crossover valve is sticking causing the unevenness from left to right?
Any thoughts learned friends?
MY16 D4 Landmark SDV6 (The Ice Maiden)
Uncle Ray's spare wheel protector
MY08 D3 HSE Stornoway (Miss Moneypit) The money tree withered......
29th Sep 2017 3:16 pm
discoagain
Member Since: 13 Jun 2015
Location: Reading
Posts: 17
Hi, if the cross-over Valve is stuck open, then it will lean if the car isn't loaded completely evenly. Fuel tank is not in the middle of the car. New valve block gets my vote, although you could carefully clean it out before replacing.
Is there a way to tell with the IID tool if the cross over valve is stuck open?
I'm guessing it will be in the live data somewhere.
Under what condition should it be closed when it stuck open?
MY16 D4 Landmark SDV6 (The Ice Maiden)
Uncle Ray's spare wheel protector
MY08 D3 HSE Stornoway (Miss Moneypit) The money tree withered......
29th Sep 2017 8:11 pm
discoagain
Member Since: 13 Jun 2015
Location: Reading
Posts: 17
Hi, I don't think you can tell using diagnosis tools. The valve needle just runs through a solenoid coil and a spring.
When I stay stuck open, it's a tiny air valve and small grain of dirt would be enough to hold it open enough to leak.
It's closed when de-energised, and should only open when the car is moving at slow speeds. the LR technical description on how EAS works has a short section on cross valves.
Cheers
30th Sep 2017 6:58 am
discoagain
Member Since: 13 Jun 2015
Location: Reading
Posts: 17
I do have one niggle though...
If it's cross valves, then every 15mind the car should try to re-cover, even if parked. when parked, it does this by releasing air on the higher side. It can't add air, so the levelling process will always drop the car overall each time it levels. if this is cross valves the car should be sinking when parked with the fuses in.
30th Sep 2017 7:06 am
discoagain
Member Since: 13 Jun 2015
Location: Reading
Posts: 17
That's the thing, it doesn't sink overnight. When you get out of the motor it will often drop the rear after you have locked it and walk away, but that's normal I believe. After that it sits still.
It's as though something it giving incorrect data to calculate what level should be across the axle. Hence changing the height sensors a while back.
I was going to rip the arch liners out this weekend to check the wiring for chaffing, but im thinking if there was a wiring issue it would be throwing faults which it doesn't.
My only other thought and it's a bit of a wild one is we had a small water leak on the drivers A pillar a few month back, could water ingress have got into the control module and be causing it. Again though no other problems or errors which would indicate a problem with the module
Cheers Nick MY16 D4 Landmark SDV6 (The Ice Maiden)
Uncle Ray's spare wheel protector
MY08 D3 HSE Stornoway (Miss Moneypit) The money tree withered......
30th Sep 2017 8:01 am
M3DPO
Member Since: 22 Sep 2010
Location: Notts.
Posts: 8103
I think you are making a mountain out of a mole hill!- 1/2 an inch is 12 mm well within tolerance of +/- 10mm per sensor, I also doubt anyone could tell by looking that one side is 12mm lower than the other.
I had a similar situation when I recalibrate mine, never after a run and checking heights did I get the same measurements, but they where always within tolerance.
I would suggest you put it in tight tolerance for a while and then check the measurements. You could also set the so called lower corner higher with the Iid tool and leave it. It can when others can't,
It will when others won't,
It goes where others don't.
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